Author: Andrew Williams
Date: 02:31:52 08/09/00
Go up one level in this thread
On August 08, 2000 at 16:00:32, Christophe Theron wrote: >On August 07, 2000 at 05:58:44, Andrew Williams wrote: > >>On August 06, 2000 at 20:10:49, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >> >>>On August 06, 2000 at 19:17:18, Tom Kerrigan wrote: >>> >>>>On August 06, 2000 at 16:37:24, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >>>> >>>>>On August 06, 2000 at 12:45:11, Dan Andersson wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>Vincent has had this idea of MTD and never managed/bothered to defend it. I >>>>>>believe it to be an unsupported opinion. >>>>> >>>>>No commercial program uses MTD. End of proof man. >>>> >>>>I thought the MP version of Fritz does. >>>> >>>>-Tom >>> >>>I never saw any MP version of Fritz in the shops so far, >>>perhaps someone is gonna state soon that DB used MTD too. >> >>Oddly enough, this seems to be what Hsu says in his IEEE Micro article. >>Unfortunately, he doesn't say quite enough to be clear: >> >> "The search control does not really implement the regular >> alpha-beta search algorithm [Ref: Knuth & Moore 1975]. Rather, >> it implements a minimum-window alpha-beta search algorithm >> [Ref: Pearl 1984]" > > > >The reference "Pearl 1984" clearly indicates that they are using PVS/Negascout. > > Christophe > I'm not certain that this is true. This is a reference to: "Heuristics : intelligent search strategies for computer problem solving". Addison-Wesley, 1984. I'm pretty sure that this book is where he first talked about the use of MT (Memory Test) as a way investigating the performance characteristics of alpha-beta searches. Andrew > >>This is a bit ambiguous, because of course PVS could be called a "minimum >>window algorithm". But the rest of the paragraph (which is too long to type >>here) does seem to suggest that DB was using something more like MTD than >>PVS. I don't know if Bob knows for sure (maybe it's in Hsu's book?). Either >>way, I'd recommend looking at the article, "IBM's Deep Blue Chess Grandmaster >>Chips", Feng-hsiung Hsu, IEEE Micro March-April 1999. The relevant section >>is "Search Control" on page 80. >> >>Having said all that, I think your argument about commercial programs and MTD >>is flawed (whether DB used MTD or not). The problem is that MTD is a relatively >>new technique, like bitboards. AFAIK, no commercial program uses bitboards >>either. I know you don't like that technique, Vincent, but no sane person >>would say that the fact that they're not widely used in commercial programs >>"proves" that they're no good as an approach to creating chess programs. >> >>Andrew
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