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Subject: Re: Uniform depth reporting proposal

Author: Andrew Williams

Date: 02:05:47 08/27/00

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On August 26, 2000 at 23:09:57, Will Singleton wrote:

>On August 26, 2000 at 15:52:38, Andrew Williams wrote:
>
>>On August 26, 2000 at 12:44:46, Will Singleton wrote:
>>
>>>On August 26, 2000 at 08:06:00, Brian Richardson wrote:
>>>
>>>>I think the information that many programs report, such as depth, score, PV,
>>>>etc) is helpful to see, and appreciate most programs doing so (particuarly when
>>>>their operators are online, or even some that have lists of opponents to
>>>>automatically kibitz).
>>>>
>>>>However, each program reports in a different manner.  I would like to propose
>>>>_some_ reporting uniformity.  I am not suggesting that standardizing _all_
>>>>information and formats should be attempted.
>>>>
>>>>In particular, the search "depth" seems like a good place to start.  Depth can
>>>>mean several different things.  I would like to propose a depth reporting format
>>>>as follows:
>>>>
>>>>ply x(y/z) where x is the last full width (normal search) ply _completed_,
>>>>z is the deepest with extensions, and z is the absolute deepest ply reached
>>>>(typically in q-search).
>>>>
>>>
>>>I assume you mean y = deepest with extensions.
>>>
>>>I don't know about standardizing.  I sort of like to compare the different
>>>formats, you get to know the idiosyncrasies of each after awhile.  Your format
>>>is unique I think, kind of verbose.  Others give a single number, like d=8,
>>>which is too sparse.  I like my method (surprise :)), that gives the depth
>>>reached plus number of ply 1 moves examined at that depth.  That shows exactly
>>>where in the ply the search terminated.
>>>
>>
>>This isn't possible with mtd engines. Yeah, I know there aren't many.
>>
>
>Hmmm... guess I haven't been paying attention.  You mean to say that you don't
>know how many root moves you've searched at a given ply?

Yes. At a given ply it will do several searches, each of which is trying to
decide if the true score for the position is higher or lower than a guess.
So the root moves can be searched multiple times. For my analysis mode under
xboard, I report something like: [+180 <= +194 <= +200] to indicate progress.
That means that PM has established that the score >=+180 and <= +200 and its
current guess is +194.

>
>>>I also like the score shown with a bit less resolution (1.1 rather than 1.13).
>>>Less is more.  I should also fix my kib feature.
>>>
>>>Will
>>
>>I like to see the score with either + or - prepended. But I also prefer 1.13
>>to 1.1 <shrug>
>
>
>For my own purposes, a resolution in hundreths is hard to assign meaning to.  My
>eval jumps around a bit, while yours seems more steady.  Have you tried
>thousandths? :)
>
>Will

My program evaluates in centipawns. I should say that I've never really given
any thought to emitting this info in tenths. I just shoved the kibitz/whisper
feature in a few weeks ago.

Andrew



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