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Subject: Re: Robert, a little question ...

Author: Frank Quisinsky

Date: 09:49:35 09/19/00

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On September 19, 2000 at 11:50:02, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On September 19, 2000 at 11:05:01, Frank Quisinsky wrote:
>
>>On September 19, 2000 at 10:16:19, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On September 19, 2000 at 01:37:39, Frank Quisinsky wrote:
>>>
>>>>Hello,
>>>>
>>>>which program can solved 9/14 positions (I think no program can solved so many
>>>>positions). Gandalf results, no 0 or 1 seconds results:
>>>>
>>>>01. 0578 seconds
>>>>02. 0980 seconds
>>>>03. 0386 seconds
>>>>04. 0449 seconds
>>>>05. 0205 seconds
>>>>06. 0252 seconds
>>>>07. 0711 seconds
>>>>08. 0486 seconds
>>>>09. ---
>>>>10. ---
>>>>11. 1151 seconds
>>>>12. ---
>>>>13. ---
>>>>14. with the right move in ~ 32 minutes !
>>>>
>>>>BS2830 = 2667 ELO
>>>>LCTII  = 2730 ELO
>>>>
>>>>In my eyes is Gandalf 4.32f the strongest program for analyses and maybe
>>>>the stronges chess programm in the world ?
>>>>
>>>>Best
>>>>Frank
>>>
>>>This has very little to do with how "strong" an engine is compared to others.
>>>It only means it solves _this_ problem set faster.
>>
>>Yes this is right.
>>
>>In my News Ticker I have 250 Gandalf games with longer time controls and ponder
>>!
>>
>>I am sure, I made a lot of tests with Gandalf in the last time. I think for
>>tactical and middelgame analyses is Gandalf a very good engine. OK, I know not
>>all commercial programs but I know a lof of results.
>>
>>BTW:
>>Crafty played very good against the playing style from Gandalf !
>>
>>A questions to Crafty:
>>I see that Crafty 17.13 is not faster then Crafty 17.11 but the new SMP version
>>is faster.
>>
>>At the moment is the dual technic factor 1.8. Do you think that factor 1.9 or
>>1.95 is possible ?
>
>At times, 2.0 is possible.  But even 1.8 is not always going to happen.  I
>even have a position or two where 2 processors are _slower_ than one.
>
>
>>
>>I have interest to get more information why is not more then factor 1.8
>>possible. I think a very interesting message for my News Ticker because more and
>>more persons have interest to buy a dual system an I think this is a interesting
>>question about SMP.
>
>
>Because move ordering is not perfect.  If you start a parallel search at a
>ply where only one move needs to be searched, the extra processor is searching
>a part of the tree that a single processor program would not search due to an
>alpha/beta cutoff.  Since move ordering is not perfect, it is impossible to
>accurately choose a position where all moves have to be searched, vs a position
>where only one move needs to be searched.
>
>As I have mentioned before, in Crafty, I am about 92% right.  That is, if I am
>going to get a beta cutoff, 92% of the time it happens on the _first_ move
>searched at a ply.  Unfortunately, that 8% where it is wrong is a real killer
>to parallel performance.
>
>Hence my 30% per processor overhead estimate.  1cpu = 1.0 speedup.  2cpu = 1.7
>speedup, 3cpu = 2.4 speedup and 4 cpu = 3.1 speedup.  All rough averages, actual
>numbers will vary wildly.

Thanks Robert, I added your message in my News Ticker.

Best
Frank

>
>
>
>
>>
>>See here (little zip file, Crafty bench results on dual and single PIII):
>>http://amateurschach.in-trier.de/schach/download/sonstige/crafty_bench2.zip
>>
>>Frank



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