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Subject: Re: penalty for opening H file of opponent when white and castled kingside

Author: Dave Gomboc

Date: 22:56:08 10/08/00

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On October 05, 2000 at 00:03:34, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On October 04, 2000 at 11:44:15, Ricardo Gibert wrote:
>
>>On October 04, 2000 at 10:22:10, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On October 04, 2000 at 07:54:00, Ricardo Gibert wrote:
>>>
>>>>On October 03, 2000 at 18:18:25, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On October 03, 2000 at 12:34:11, Uri Blass wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On October 03, 2000 at 11:58:05, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On October 02, 2000 at 13:54:23, Mike Adams wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>The move that my freind said crafty considered was the pawn takes knight move
>>>>>>>>toward the end.  Knight takes bishop earlier wreked the positon and i dont think
>>>>>>>>pulsar would get itself into that kind of postion again with the current
>>>>>>>>evaluate.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>taking the knight isn't particularly bad.  NxB opens a file against your own
>>>>>>>king.  PxN (I assume that is the knight you are talking about taking) is a
>>>>>>>reasonable move for white.  He wants that open file.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Mike did not mean to that knight.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>He meant to taking the knight by gxf3 in the following line
>>>>>>
>>>>>>[D]r1bq1rk1/ppp2p2/2n4p/3pP1pn/3P4/2P2NB1/P1P1B1PP/R2QK2R b KQ - 0 14
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Nxg3 hxg3 g4???? Qd2 gxf3????
>>>>>>
>>>>>>avoiding gxf3 is a simple tactics.
>>>>>>Crafty17.11 can see at depth 7 that gxf3 is bad.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The bigger problem is to avoid g4 and crafty17.11 needs depth 9 for it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Fritz5.32 can avoid gxf3 at depth 5 and it can avoid g4 also at depth 5.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Hiarcs4 can avoid gxf3 at depth 3.
>>>>>>Faile 1.4.4 can avoid gxf3 at depth 6.
>>>>>>CometB02 can avoid gxf3 at depth 5.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>All these programs that are not the best programs need few seconds or less than
>>>>>>1 second on a slow hardware to avoid gxf3.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I think that you need to improve the tactical ability of your program and
>>>>>>working on positional knowledge is less important.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Chess is a tactical game.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Uri
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Yes... but the tactical ability improves automatically.  You should try it on
>>>>>my quad xeon.  It fries tactical things there.  :)
>>>>
>>>>Crafty is a good program, but perhaps the way you should be looking at this is
>>>>maybe you would write a better program if you were running on slower hardware.
>>>>Fast hardware can cover up a lot of deficiencies of a program as you have
>>>>essentially pointed out.
>>>
>>>Why design for obsolete hardware?  Within a year or two everybody will be on
>>>hardware faster than my quad xeon (which is probably about the speed of a
>>>1.5ghz machine or so).  With only so many hours available for working on Crafty,
>>>spending time on the parts that new hardware won't fix makes more sense, IMHO.
>>
>>I'm sure there is some truth to what you are saying, but if Crafty needs to
>>search to a greater depth to find the same tactics, isn't that a sign of some
>>type of inefficiency?
>
>
>Not to me.  The issue is whether it finds it or not when playing a game.  Not
>whether it needs a 10 ply or 12 ply to find it...

I don't buy this -- if Crafty requires a 12-ply search where other programs
require a 10-ply search, then positions will also exist where Crafty requires a
16-ply search where other programs require only a 14-ply search.  Ceteris
paribus, of course.

Dave



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