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Subject: Re: PLEASE can someone test CM 6,7,8000 with other programs?

Author: John Merlino

Date: 11:07:58 04/02/01

Go up one level in this thread


On April 02, 2001 at 06:37:22, stuart taylor wrote:

>On April 01, 2001 at 13:37:31, Jorge wrote:
>
>>On April 01, 2001 at 06:31:46, stuart taylor wrote:
>>
>>>On April 01, 2001 at 01:39:10, Jorge wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 01, 2001 at 00:21:52, Lin Harper wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On March 31, 2001 at 22:15:53, stuart taylor wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>I'm longing to get to the bottom of this, and to know exactly where each of
>>>>>>CM6000, CM7000 and CM8000 stand, in relation to each other, as well as compared
>>>>>>to a selection of other programs, and how the three CMs compare in their
>>>>>>comparisons to a few other programs.
>>>>>>  Can someone do this one time, despite any difficulties involved?
>>>>>>S.Taylor
>>>>>     I've got CM6K and CM8K, no other recent programs. I've only got one
>>>>>  computer, and that's the problem most people have. It's not good playing
>>>>>  two programs against each other, with ponder off on both programs, IMO,
>>>>>  because ponder on is the default on them all (I think), and that's the
>>>>>  only way to give a program it's full rein. Different programs will not
>>>>>  necessarily be handicapped equally with ponder off. That's where auto
>>>>>  232 comes in.
>>>>
>>>>Yes, I have 2 compupters (PentIII 667 and Athlon 500, 128 Ram)and have both
>>>>programs 6K and 8K installed. I don't have Auto232 though, so I play some of the
>>>>games by hand.
>>>
>>>That could do a good job, I think, if you play all play all 8 games, but 4 on
>>>each computer (2x Black and 2x White), and switch computers, so that each has
>>>the same benefits and the same slight handicaps. That will also show how much
>>>the slight speed differences affect each, if at all.
>>>S.Taylor
>>All right, I'm curious to find out too. Let me know which settings (Default? for
>>both 6K and 8K) and Time control I can use. I will post the games here.
>
>That would be wonderful!
>I think that tournament timings or thereabouts would be most interesting to know
>about. Other settings, whatever is both strongest, and most equal to each other,
>then rotate for the other half of the games.
>  If it can be an actual minature tournament, that would be excellent, by adding
>one, two or three other of the high level programs and making it all play all,
>so we can see how both CM's compare in their handling of each other program.
> But a simple match will also be great. And if it is 8 games each, that gives a
>very good chance for getting a good idea of things, as each computer can have
>twice white and twice black for each of the CM's.(6K and 8K)
> Four games each (in this way) is also good, especially if it is too much work,
>and you're adding other programs (even one).
>thanks,
>S.Taylor

To get ANY reasonable conclusion from a tournament between two programs, I
suspect you would need at LEAST 20 games (and others here -- the more
statistically aware of us -- would say that you probably need closer to 50-100
games).

Eight games will prove nothing, even if the score is 8-0 for the winner.

Sadly, the only way to compare CM6000 vs. CM8000 is manually WITH TWO MACHINES.
Running both of these programs on the same machine gives a CPU advantage to
CM6000. I doubt many people have the time and the hardware for this kind of
testing, so getting the required number of games will take quite a long time.

jm



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