Computer Chess Club Archives


Search

Terms

Messages

Subject: Re: Questions on dual machines

Author: Slater Wold

Date: 14:44:54 11/21/01

Go up one level in this thread


On November 21, 2001 at 15:30:25, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On November 21, 2001 at 14:04:57, Slater Wold wrote:
>
>>On November 21, 2001 at 13:33:14, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On November 21, 2001 at 11:52:09, Slater Wold wrote:
>>>
>>>>On November 21, 2001 at 11:19:08, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On November 21, 2001 at 11:05:00, Slater Wold wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>As I have found positions where the NPS search is 2.5x faster, but it solves the
>>>>>>solution in 4x faster than a single cpu.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Dann and I had this "super" linear discussion before.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Seems like it would even out, eventually.  But like I said, I believe you.  And
>>>>>>I'll do it to solution now.  (But of course, I'll still look at the NPS!)  :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>First, two cpus is going to have a _hard_ time searching 2.5x the raw
>>>>>nodes per second.  I have no idea how that might happen, unless there is a
>>>>>bug in the node-counting that sometimes counts nodes twice.
>>>>
>>>>Sorry.  I've seen positions where it will search 1.8x the NPS and solve it 4x
>>>>faster.
>>>
>>>That is not uncommon at all...
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>I was just reversing your comment.
>>>>
>>>>>Second, "super-linear" can happen on occasional positions.  But as you said,
>>>>>it will average out over multiple positions so that the speedup simply can not
>>>>>be >2.0 for two processors on average.  I was in the middle of the super-linear
>>>>>speedup discussion.  I hope it stays "at rest" now. :)
>>>>
>>>>I've seen it happen a time or two.  I've found a solution one go, and can never
>>>>get it again.  (Happened more than once with DJ7.)
>>>>
>>>>>I have seen several cases of spectacular speedups, but then I have also seen
>>>>>an equal number of horrible speedups.  Bruce once sent me one that produced
>>>>>a particularly ugly result on Crafty, But I can't seem to locate the thing
>>>>>at present...
>>>>
>>>>I think I've only seen 1 or 2.  But I have seen a LOT that are greater than the
>>>>speedup of the NPS speedup.  In other words, it takes the SMP less nodes to find
>>>>the solutions, that the 1 CPU.
>>>>
>>>
>>>That is the classic super-linear speedup situation.  bad move ordering
>>>corrected by the parallel search taking 'em two at a time.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>In any case, NPS is kind of like engine RPM.  It should increase linearly with
>>>>>the number of processors, assuming the parallel algorithm is good at keeping
>>>>>both cpus busy all the time and doesn't have one (or more) sitting around
>>>>>waiting excessively.  But RPM has nothing to do with vehicle speed, because
>>>>>of losses along the drive train.  The MPH value (time to solution) is the thing
>>>>>that wins races (or games).
>>>>
>>>>HUM.  Now you're picking a subject I am _very_ familiar with.  RPM's and and MPH
>>>>aren't _DIRECTLY_ related.
>>>>
>>>>IE:
>>>>
>>>>If you have a car that has a 4.11 gear ratio with 351c.i. motor, that is getting
>>>>400 HP at 5750RPM, it SHOULD go 12's in the 1/4 mile.  (Depending on weight.)
>>>>Let's just say, it goes 12.5 @ 119MPH.
>>>>
>>>>Now, let's say you install an aluminum driveshaft.  Your RPM's are going to
>>>>increase.  Same setup, same everything, it will probably get 400HP at 5900 RPM.
>>>>And if you run the 1/4 mile again, I would guarantee 12.3's at the SAME MPH.
>>>>Maybe, you'll get 1 or 2 more MPH.  You're going .2 seconds faster, but the MPH
>>>>isn't changing.  RPM doesn't = MPH, but the faster you can rev, the faster you
>>>>can get to that top MPH.  Unless your gears are wacky.
>>>
>>>You do better than I do there.  I've never seen an alum drive shaft increase
>>>RPM.  I have seen it decrease the time to reach a particular RPM, but I don't
>>>see why it would increase the actual RPM since it doesn't take much energy to
>>>keep a driveshaft rotating, it just takes energy to accelerate it down the
>>>track, and energy to accelerate the RPM level of the shaft itself.
>>
>>On a fox body Mustang, an aluminum driveshaft over the stock driveshaft will
>>improve the cars 1/4 mile times by around .2 seconds.  I've seen it done more
>>than a dozen times.  I never meant to imply that the RPM's would go higher, but
>>that the time to get to X RPM would get shorter.  And I know a lighter
>>driveshaft will put the powerband of the car slightly higher.  I also know it
>>will not help your cars top speed.  Only off the line accleration.
>>
>>>Your above example can't work however, as you didn't change the rear end ratio,
>>>and if you reach a higher rpm you will _definitely_ reach a higher top speed as
>>>well.  RPM and MPH are exactly proportional if everything else (tire diameter
>>>and final drive ratio) remains constant.
>>
>>You're correct.  If you're in 4th gear at 3k RPM, you will always be going X
>>MPH.  It's only if you change gears that will change.  However, the off the line
>>accleration is what's going to get you those better times.  You're getting to X
>>RPM faster, and therefore X MPH faster, which means you're going to gain SOME
>>ground.
>
>
>That's actually what we are racing, in fact.  :)  1990 coupe.
>
>Goes like the blazes...

I've had several.  Namely a 351 '92.  It flew.

You'll have to e-mail me about yours.  There are a few video's of mine on the
internet.



This page took 0 seconds to execute

Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700

Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.