Author: Marc van Hal
Date: 17:00:03 01/10/02
Go up one level in this thread
On January 09, 2002 at 17:15:27, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >On January 08, 2002 at 18:47:35, Bas Hamstra wrote: > >>On January 07, 2002 at 16:56:46, Uri Blass wrote: >> >>>On January 07, 2002 at 14:53:25, Bas Hamstra wrote: >>> >>>>On January 07, 2002 at 13:44:43, Joshua Lee wrote: >>>> >>>>>you are Ill informed . As much as i think the SSDF is Inaccurate in it's >>>>>ratings it does a few things that are consistent: >>>>>1 Shows which programs are stronger than others and on what hardware >>>>> >>>>>This is the only point i need to make to totally bust your argument because >>>>>if you look at the estimated ammounts they give for each of their hardware >>>>>increases or if you take the averages from one set of hardware to another you >>>>>should see clearly that in reality there is a definite increase in most newer >>>>>versions. I don't know how the program authors do it but they do..... >>>>>look at Junior 6 and 7 on a K6-2 450. >>>> >>>>I dont see your point. I am not saying that programs don't improve. But I do say >>>>that Junior 7 does not stand a chance against Junior 6 on 2x slower hardware. >>>>Can you find 1 program where a newer version beats an older on 2x slower >>>>hardware? >>>> >>>>Bas. >>> >>>Yes >>> >>>Fritz7 on old hardware beats Fritz3 on fast hardware >>>if the hardware adavantage is 2:1 >>> >>>I am not sure about Fritz7b and Fritz6 but >>>it may be interesting to test. >>> >>>Uri >> >>How do you know? Data! Numbers, tables. Photo's :-) Are you willing to take a >>bet? I say Fritz3 is going to win. >> >> >>Bas. > >Great we go bet about money. Fritz3 at 1.2Ghz with its own book >at 3 minutes a move vs 450Mhz PII fritz7a + fritz7 book. > >this is the match i can offer potentially if we can bet for money. > >I give 3vs1 because this is going to be 100% score. First of all programs have not increased to much in strenght Because I think the only thing which changed is end game tabelbases improved openingsbooks, piece table bases And personelty tweakings. With the exeption of Junior wich has been improved with a litle more positional knowledge and posistion learning (well tuned piece table bases) I am still not sure if Rebel has improved in strenght by programming Ofcourse the settings of the personelety is much beter tuned then Rebel 10 was And ok I think Fritz has not improved after Fritz5 (Also changed piece table which in some positions improved the program but it lost some strenght in certain positions too because of this) Secondly Computerchess not always show which program is stronger But who won more games wich is basicly not the same. I actualy came to a new idea instead of looking who won most games it is looking at the games and rate the games on strenght Gufeld for instance played some games which should be rated with 2800+ While he never came close to this rating. Rebel and Tiger also played a game of 2800+ not of brilancy but simply because it could not be improved. This also is in handy for improving openings books . I think that Rebel 10 with antigm still can show some nice tricks on a 300Mhz system. Versus Fritz7 on a 1200mhz system It might be worth a try Ofcourse it is not an honest contest but intresting. Only important part is that it will be only games of 40moves\120 minutes I also think that Junior is the program where the cpu it is running on is of importance While with Fritz it is the amount of ram it is running on which is of importance I always see Chessmaster and some personeletys of chessmaster like Botvinik and Kasparov Morphy When they are not set too draw to early as a good benchmark of the improved strenght of the other programs. You might be laughing your hart out by know But Fritz and Junior realy have much trouble with the Botvinik personelety of chessmaster Regards Marc van Hal
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