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Subject: Re: Another Way to Make Comparisons of Engines More Accurate

Author: Robert Henry Durrett

Date: 15:03:38 08/28/98

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On August 28, 1998 at 16:36:29, Serge Desmarais wrote:

>On August 28, 1998 at 12:55:57, Robert Henry Durrett wrote:
>
>>Why not obtain, and create a library of, the opening books of all of the current
>>chess engines [maybe others not so current too - maybe] and test all engines
>>with all of the books?
>>
>>This may be too big a project, so may not be practical for that reason alone.
>>
>>The thought behind this suggestion is that such a testing program would point
>>out any dependences on books as well as to make comparisons of the "engines
>>without their books" more informative relative to the true inherent strengths
>>and weaknesses of the engines. It might also point out highly specific needs for
>>improvements in some of the engines.
>
>
>   You are assuming that the opening books are a kind of "cover up" of their
>respective program's weaknesses, if I understand you well?
>
>Serge Desmarais

(1) Disclaimer:  Please recall my previous "admission" that I am not a
professional chess software programmer.  What I was thinking may or may not make
sense to a person with intimate knowledge of the inner workings of such
software.  If not, I hope one of those people will squelch this idea now.
(2) I do not regard modern chess engines to be "weak" at all.  They are, it
seems to me, very strong indeed.
(3) The purpose I had in mind was to unmask the basic [but very strong] engine
from the opening books so that any inherent "weaknesses" could more easily be
identified.
(4) Currently, any weaknesses which would cause the engine to not perform
perfectly in the early opening are masked by the opening book.
(5) But people here on CCC have recently posted some very good reasons why chess
engines should not be entered into competitions "naked" i.e. without an opening
book.
(6) The competitions between engines are both competitions in inherent strengths
of the basic engines [without books] and competitions in development of better
books.
(7) Keep in mind that programs like Fritz have rating increases of only a few
points every now and then.  The threads dealing with statistics have shown that
it takes quite a few games to determine with any confidence that such a rating
increase is "real."
(8) When you are dealing with very small rating increases, as noted in another
thread, it is unclear whether this increase was due to an improved book or to an
improvement in the way the engine arrives at it's next move when out of book.
(9) So, maybe I am thinking that the books "cover up" engine performance
weaknesses, as you say.



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