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Subject: Re: Why set Ponder=off in a comp to comp match?

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 03:39:42 10/08/02

Go up one level in this thread


On October 08, 2002 at 06:32:43, Kurt Utzinger wrote:

>On October 08, 2002 at 05:52:11, Bernhard Bauer wrote:
>
>>On October 08, 2002 at 03:01:00, Kurt Utzinger wrote:
>>
>>>On October 07, 2002 at 23:11:32, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On October 07, 2002 at 18:33:43, Jeremiah Penery wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On October 07, 2002 at 18:29:35, Uri Blass wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On October 07, 2002 at 18:19:29, Jorge wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>This may be a dumb question, but could someone tell me the reason for setting
>>>>>>>Ponder=off in comp to comp matches? If two computers with the same hardware with
>>>>>>>different, each with a program playing each other, why set ponder off?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>thnx,
>>>>>>>jorge
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Usually the people who play games with ponder off use only one computer and not
>>>>>>2 computers.
>>>>>
>>>>>Why set ponder off with one computer?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>The basic idea is that one computer matches are not very informative.  You have
>>>>two
>>>>choices:
>>>>
>>>>1.  Ponder=on.  Engines can "steal" time from each other since both will be
>>>>computing most
>>>>of the time.  Unless one is unlucky enough to not have anything to ponder.  For
>>>>that move, the
>>>>opponent runs twice as fast.
>>>>
>>>>2.  Ponder=off.  This might cause poor time utilization as it is an unnatural
>>>>way to run and
>>>>is not always very well tested.
>>>>
>>>>Either way causes problems.  Moral?  Use two computers or else don't pay a
>>>>significant amount
>>>>of attention to the results.
>>>
>>>
>>>Previous and still running tests with quite a lot of games in Germany prove that
>>>there is no significant difference in results between matches played with either
>>>ponder on/off. And most surprisingly - contrary to your assumption - this also
>>>refers to Crafty.
>>>Kurt
>>>
>>>
>>>The running test
>>
>>As many computer chess fans are only interested in results and not in game
>>quality it doesn't matter wether you play with ponder on or off.
>>And it doesn't matter wether you play a game using 2 hours for 40 moves or only
>>1 hour. The results are the same.
>>And it doesn't matter wether you play a game using 1 hours for 40 moves or only
>>30 minutes. The results are the same. I think that has been proven in Germany.
>>And Crafty plays better without ponder than with ponder has been posted in
>>Germany too.
>>So what? Let them play without ponder at all.
>>regards
>>Bernhard
>
>Hi Bernhard
>Your conclusion is wrong. If you use two PC's and let one program play with
>ponder=on and the other one with ponder=off, the program without ponder will
>have no chance.
>Kurt

Pondering may help but saying that the program without ponder will have no
chance is clearly wrong.

Uri



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