Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 18:52:27 11/30/03
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On November 30, 2003 at 16:37:17, Dieter Buerssner wrote: >On November 30, 2003 at 13:57:19, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 30, 2003 at 13:22:20, Dieter Buerssner wrote: >>>Note, we first see the move, and then the info: "game drawn", which can easily >>>be interpreted as not correct. >> >>No it can't. Because to play a game of chess, you are required to _move_ the >>pieces, and _press_ the clock. That is why humans have "blind rules" for a >>player that can't see. And the rules explain this very clearly. If the >>draw is a repetition before the move is played, > >I am not sure, you read my post carefully. Neither do I find any indication in >the FIDE chess rules, that would support your point. I looked at: >http://www.fide.com/official/handbook.asp?level=EE101 > >There I find: >--- >9.2 The game is drawn, upon a correct claim by the player having the move, when >the same position, for at least the third time (not necessarily by sequential >repetition of moves) > >a) is about to appear, if he first writes his move on his scoresheet and >declares to the arbiter his intention to make this move, or > >b) has just appeared, and the player claiming the draw has the move. >--- > >Crafty made a move, and then claimed the draw. Crafty can't make a move. It asks its human proxy (the blind operator) to do this. That was my point. My program can't move a piece, nor stop the clock, nor call the arbiter. If we take the proxy out, as I have been suggesting for 25+ years, and use automatic interfaces, then this is no longer a problem. The program has to do it right or fail to get the draw... But right now the _human_ simply relays the computer's wishes to the other party, not taking an active role. Does it really matter on the screen which comes first? If so, why? Do you assume that what appears at the bottom of the screen comes after what appears at the top? Not all GUIs follow that protocol... So nothing should be inferred other than the computer says "I claim a draw" "this is my move". Forget FIDE rules, they simply don't apply in this instance until we go to an automatic interface (as we do in CCT) where the programs _can_ make moves and offer draws directly... > This seems not to be in >accordance with the above rule. I also looked at the rules for handicapped >players at http://www.fide.com/official/handbook.asp?level=EE2. I cannot find >anything, that supports your point. Please point it out to me. > >Regards, >Dieter > >PS. I don't want to say, that those rules are particually suited for engine >matches. But that is another problem. not it isn't because we don't use FIDE rules. There are specific computer chess rules that supersede them, particularly those about the operator making moves, and making mistakes, and backing up to correct mistakes. FIDE rules _never_ back up a game...
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