Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 08:15:24 12/01/03
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On November 30, 2003 at 17:39:45, Bob Durrett wrote: >On November 30, 2003 at 13:53:32, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 30, 2003 at 12:54:45, Eugene Nalimov wrote: >> >>>For me situation is less clear here. See >>>http://www.talkchess.com/forums/1/message.html?332067 >>> >>>Thanks, >>>Eugene >> >>It looks very clear to me: >> >>It should not be allowed that programs use someone else's GUI. Because the >>GUI has chess knowledge built into it, say for opening book line selection, >>tablebase probing, draw claiming, etc. > ><snip> > >It would seem that chess-playing programs have evolved from simple easy to >understand programs, using common-sense user-friendly programming rules, into >complex messes. It sounds as if "GUI" is no longer the proper word for the >non-engine software. I agree. I have complained about this in the past. A "GUI" can become a major part of a chess engine. IE if a typical game lasts 40 moves, and the program is in book for 20 moves, the GUI and book author are responsible for 1/2 of the total engine's performance. Since they provided 1/2 of the total moves played. That is wrong. It always has been wrong. But it wasn't an issue except with commercial entries. It has been escalating however. I've seen complaints about authors using commercial books. The commercial guys complain. But they think it fine if the book author picks 2-3 programs that can use his book. That is also wrong. > >I admit that I do not understand how tablebase data gets used by a chess-playing >program. If I understand the above comment correctly, it now appears that the >"GUI" portion is doing much more than just providing a user interface and is >also performing the role of an executive? The "GUI" is also serving as an >interface between the engine and external programs such as tablebase programs? >The "GUI" is making decisions? yes. It chooses which book moves to play. If it sees a tablebase position, it usurps the engine and chooses the tablebase move itself. It claims draws by repetition, stalemate and 50-moves/insufficient material, etc. > >Do I have that right? > >What a mess! A programmer's nightmare if there ever was one. > >Incidentally, the use of an executive [or similar] is not itself the problem. >Putting it into a "GUI" is the apparent mistake. > >Bob D.
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