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Subject: Re: please answer this question too!

Author: Tord Romstad

Date: 09:22:16 03/23/04

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On March 23, 2004 at 11:31:18, martin fierz wrote:

>On March 23, 2004 at 10:14:05, Tord Romstad wrote:
>
>>One of the really embarassing things about Gothmog's eval of this position
>>is that it doesn't even consider the bishop on g1 to be a bad biship.  My
>>bad bishop eval is based on the number of *blocked* pawns on squares of the
>>bishop's colour.  In the position we discuss, there are only two such pawns
>>(on e3 and g3).  Therefore Gothmog thinks that the g1 bishop isn't really
>>that bad.  It has limited mobility, but it should be easy to relocate it
>>to a better square.
>
>perhaps you should change your definition a bit. the pawn on f2 is virtually
>blocked too, and the pawn on c4 is rather blocked and with it the one on c3. in
>any case, the f2-pawn should be recognizable as blocked.
>to evaluate my bishops, i use a sum of c1*(blocked pawns on that color) +
>c2*(unblocked pawns on that color). i think that is a better way of doing it.
>still it's not good, because as said, the g1-bishop would be just fine on a3 or
>on f4.

Thanks for the suggestions.  You are probably right, I should have a look
at my bad bishop code.

>>As so often, Gothmog's eval proves to be the worst of them all.
>no!!! as i said you asked the wrong question! you didn't even answer the right
>question yourself, and all others won't answer it either as i know them... the
>right question is:
>
>***************************************************************
>"please give me your static eval with bishop on g1, c1 and a3".
>***************************************************************
>
>my answer is "-0.49 (g1), -0.51(c1), -0.35(a3)."

... and my answer is "+0.24 (g1), +0.18 (c1), +0.31 (a3)".

>as you can see, my answer is always about the same, and for example ridiculous
>in that g1 is preferred over c1 (reason: the rook's mobility is smaller for
>Bc1).

Same thing here, as you can see from my numbers.

>i will bet another beer (you owe me one IIRC)

I do.  :-)

>that most of the people who
>answered your post (and of who you think they are evaluating this better) have
>similar problems. e.g. the position with the bishop on c1/a3 is roughly equal
>(well, with the Ba3 you in fact immediately win a pawn, but just philosophically
>speaking, white has little to fear with a pawn for the exchange and the bishop
>pair) and all those guys who gave a big negative score for white will still be
>giving a big negative score for white (because nobody is realizing that the
>g1-bishop is the big problem, they just think exchange=2 pawns), and gothmog's
>eval will be the superior one.

Do you think that white has the advantage with the bishop at c1?

Exchange=1.75 pawns in Gothmog, by the way.

Tord




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