Author: Eugene Nalimov
Date: 12:39:57 08/12/04
Go up one level in this thread
On August 12, 2004 at 13:01:59, Christophe Theron wrote: >... > >You can purchase *some* *selected* models from Dell/IBM/Toshiba/HP with Linux >preinstalled. Exactly. And that's what happens with cars, too. Returning to my analogy -- you can buy *some* *selected* Honda cars with Bose audio equipment. And I am not sure you can buy e.g. Dodge with Bose equipment at all. Is that the fault of the manufacturer of the audio equipment that is installed in Dodge? >Here for example you can indeed purchase a Dell server system that comes >preinstalled with Linux. >But that's all about it. > >There is *NO* way you will be able to purchase a Dell/IBM/Toshiba/HP laptop or >even desktop computer with either Linux preinstalled or with no system at all. Sorry, that should be problem of Dell in *your* country. In my original reply I posted link to Dell workstations with preinstalled Linux. I am not lazy, I found that mail and I am posting it once again: http://www1.us.dell.com/content/products/compare.aspx/precn_n?c=us&cs=&l=en&s=bsd& >Nobody in France or elsewhere can buy a laptop computer from these manufacturers >without Windows installed on it. I mean unless you have some very special >relationship with the manufacturer. > >Enter a shop and try to purchase a laptop without Windows: it is IMPOSSIBLE. As you can see, manufacturers *are* selling desktop Linux systems, so obviously they are selling Linux products *when they think enough people will buy the product.* >The workaround for this is, in theory, to buy the computer, to refuse the >Microsoft EULA when you start the OS for the first time, and to ask for a refund >of the OS. In practice it is also impossible to get this refund. And I also do >not understand why I would have first to pay without discussion for an item I'm >not going to use just to get a refund later. That's crazy. Even if it was >possible - and it's not. Once again, you are buying product you don't need from computer manufacturer, not from Microsoft. Microsoft *allows* computer manufacturer to sell systems with other OSes. >This situation has been for years, and the worse about it is that it is ILLEGAL >in France to link the purchase of software to the purchase of the hardware. > >You can say it is not completely Microsoft's fault, and you are probably partly >right. However, I remember that some years ago there have been investigations >over some special terms in the contracts between Microsoft and several >manufacturers. The terms explicitely gave a better price to the manufacturer for >every copy of Windows if the manufacturer agreed to not sell any other operating >system, and to not sell any computer without an operating system. > >It is obvious that Microsoft has for a very long time pressured the >manufacturers in order to maintain its monopoly, and it is most probably still >doing it at this time, maybe in a smarter way. In the USA exclusive contracts are legal as long as you are not a monopoly. The moment court decided Microsoft is a monopoly, OEM contracts were changed. As I wrote in one of my previous posts, settlement terms explicitly forces MS to sell Windows to top 20 OEMs for the same price, and MS allows them to sell any OS they wish with their systems. Thanks, Eugene > > Christophe > > > > > >>>I did not know about Windows covering up faulty hardware - so computer suppliers >>>can make money out of selling shoddy goods. >> >>Yes, and Windows contains workarounds for bugs in software applications as well. >>Not only for Microsoft applications -- people who looked at the leaked Windows >>source found workarounds for tens of 3rd party products. >> >>>Yes, M9.2 (at least) emptied LG CD ROM bioses. Not sure if this was entirely >>>the fault of the software. IIRC, I think the CD responded in an atypical, if >>>not wrong, manner to a software probe. >> >>Yes, problem may be in the hardware, but often it's possible to change the >>software so the problem does not manifest itself. Average user doesn't want to >>ship his PC to the manufacturer so his CD drive would be replaced. He wants to >>be able just to use it. >> >>>Nice image of shops selling (broken) hardware as a way of making money out of >>>the 'free' installed software......but does this not illustrate that MS are >>>subsidising computer sellers in order to maintain their strangle-hold on the >>>market ;-) Co-bundling is illegal of course, in some countries. >> >>OEMs choose the prices, not MS, and there are lot of them, and they are >>(supposedly) independent ones. By settlement terms MS is forced to license its >>software to the top 20 OEMs on the unifom terms. >> >>Thanks, >>Eugene >> >>>Frank
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