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Subject: Re: Material-only search from the starting position

Author: Dann Corbit

Date: 14:20:15 01/10/05

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On January 10, 2005 at 17:02:40, Duncan Roberts wrote:

>On January 10, 2005 at 15:18:09, Andrew Williams wrote:
>
>>Hi,
>>
>>Last Friday (7th January 2005) I started PM on a material-only search from the
>>starting position. This was in response to a request from Duncan Roberts:
>>
>>http://www.talkchess.com/forums/2/message.html?151665
>>
>>On Saturday 8th, I posted a progress report:
>>
>>http://www.talkchess.com/forums/2/message.html?151865
>>
>>I was hopeful that PM would finish 35 plies over the weekend, but it didn't
>>happen. When I got up this morning, there had been no progress since Saturday
>>afternoon and I didn't want to leave my PC on all day. PM had had 43 hours since
>>it finished ply 34, but although it was still burning CPU time, there was no
>>more output. The last I heard from PM was:
>>
>>30=  +0.00   00:28:36.541087088735   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6
>>                                     5.b4 axb4 6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6
>>                                     8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1 10.Bxa1 g6
>>                                     11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3
>>31>  +0.00   01:00:13.772083574223   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 Qe7 13.d4
>>31<  +0.01   01:09:45.04-1811636011   1.a3
>>31=  +0.00   01:09:45.04-1811636011   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                      6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                      10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 Qe7 13.d4
>>32>  +0.00   02:09:55.47 303672321   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 Qe7 13.d4 Kd8
>>32<  +0.01   02:27:21.531056234340   1.a3
>>32=  +0.00   02:27:21.531056234340   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 Qe7 13.d4 Kd8
>>33>  +0.00   05:02:57.082077668534   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 e5 13.e3
>>33<  +0.01   05:41:54.93-634541739   1.a3
>>33=  +0.00   05:41:55.06-634541739   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 e5 13.e3
>>34>  +0.00   11:36:50.42-1671302356  1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 e5 13.e3 Ke7
>>                                     14.Qe2
>>34<  +0.01   13:09:24.491898767447   1.a3
>>34=  +0.00   13:09:24.491898767447   1.a3 a6 2.a4 a5 3.b3 b6 4.c3 c6 5.b4 axb4
>>                                     6.cxb4 e6 7.Bb2 Nf6 8.b5 cxb5 9.axb5 Rxa1
>>                                     10.Bxa1 g6 11.Nc3 d6 12.Nf3 e5 13.e3 Ke7
>>                                     14.Qe2
>>
>>I'm posting this output purely for completeness. The node counts overflowed on
>>ply 31 and the PVs are probably pretty nonsensical.
>>
>>Andrew
>
>
>thanks for doing it. No one has ever taken it before to this level, so even
>though the chances were as you say slight, it was still imo worth doing.
>there is also a record here of what you have done in case anybody wants to take
>this further.
>
>re ricardo . imo what ever happens you have added to the body of chess
>knowledge.
>
>If you find nothing then there is added likelihood maybe probability there is no
>material gain in 34 moves.

No.  That is not what it shows.  It only shows that it is unlikely, because null
move pruning was used.

>if you find a material gain, it can be investigated further with a regular chess
>engine to make sure that the gain is genuine, and black has no compensation,
>positional or otherwise.
>
>
>
>Is there any chance you will give uri's 6 move start a try in the future ?
>
>
>duncan



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