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Subject: Re: Email Fraud

Author: KarinsDad

Date: 08:42:11 01/23/99

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On January 23, 1999 at 10:09:50, Don Dailey wrote:

>On January 23, 1999 at 01:34:52, KarinsDad wrote:
>
>>On January 22, 1999 at 22:36:50, Don Dailey wrote:
>>
>>>On January 22, 1999 at 15:00:04, KarinsDad wrote:
>>>
>>>>On January 22, 1999 at 14:45:39, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On January 22, 1999 at 08:08:07, Steffen Jakob wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On January 22, 1999 at 02:15:59, Bruce Moreland wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On January 21, 1999 at 15:16:37, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>[...]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Fake email address in what sense?  You can't get a password without having a
>>>>>>>real email address, since the password is sent to the email address.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I think Dan meant those Email accounts which you can get free from several
>>>>>>public services (e.g. gmx, bigfoot, ...).
>>>>>That is one issue.  It would not be a problem if the services were not abused to
>>>>>allow hanky-panky.  But they are sometimes.  Another is that people can get an
>>>>>account, then delete the email account used to get access and continue to post.
>>>>>I have had emails bounce before, trying to send an email to the originator of a
>>>>>message.
>>>>
>>>>This problem is easier to resolve though.
>>>>
>>>>Once a month or so, have CCC send an Email to everyone. If an Email bounces, try
>>>>it again a day later or so and if it still bounces, disable the account. You
>>>>could even do this at random times so that people wouldn't know that it occurs
>>>>at the end of the month, to get new Email and CCC accounts at the beginning of
>>>>the month. If anyone accidentally got caught with a problem such as their ISP
>>>>was down for a few days and couldn't get back in, they could always Email CCC
>>>>that they cannot get back in and why their Email was disabled. I think the
>>>>frequency of problems of this type is low enough that the solution would be
>>>>fine.
>>>>
>>>>Some ISPs give out free accounts for 30 days or so, so you couldn't eliminate
>>>>the problem completely. You could only attempt to minimize it.
>>>>
>>>>This solution could also be used to eventually clean up the server of obsolete
>>>>accounts.
>>>>
>>>>You could also state right up front that the free Email accounts that are abused
>>>>will invalidate that service for everyone (such as if someone uses hotmail.com
>>>>to cause problems, all free hotmail.com accounts are busted). This may prevent a
>>>>few non-paying Email contributors from getting access here, but for those of us
>>>>who do pay an ISP (which is probably a high percentage), it would minimize these
>>>>types of abuse problems here (such as Sean's 91+ accounts).
>>>>
>>>>Do these solutions seem reasonable?
>>>>
>>>>KarinsDad
>>>
>>>I think your idea is quite good.   I'm not sure I like the idea
>>>about disabling a whol provider however since this could prevent
>>>us from getting a good member and would prevent them from getting
>>>the benefit of our group.
>>>
>>>- Don
>>
>>I don't like it either. It was an extreme measure for when someone overly
>>abusive uses that provider. I figured that after the heat wore down, a few
>>weeks, a month, whatever, the provider could be re-allowed. This would be
>>unfortunate, but how do you stop the person who is abusive and just keeps going
>>back to the same provider for free Email addresses as you ban him each time? At
>>least if they try to get a fake Email (i.e. get a real one and drop it), then
>>they may have to pay at least for a month of an ISP.
>>
>>KarinsDad
>
>Yes, it's one of those things that don't have an elegant solution so
>what you suggest is as good as any.   One possibility is to alert any
>potential member to the possibility that if they are from a given
>provider they may have to use an alternative type of registration.
>Instead of sending them a password, ICD sends them an email asking
>them to call ICD to get their password.  ICD then gets a phone number
>from them and calls them back to verify.   Yes, it's a little extra
>procedure, but if you want to solve a problem a little extra procedure
>will probably be required.   Even if ICD skipped the callback
>verification part, it would be very effective I think.
>
>Most of
>these types of cowards thrive on anonymity.

Just like me! I thrive on anonymity. :)

>  Just like most thiefs,
>they want to do their work under cover and any human interaction
>would make them uncomfortable.  Talking to a person at ICD would
>also give ICD the chance to recognize a voice and would limit the
>number of possible times they could be fooled.
>My recommendation is that ICD would try to take a little bit of
>time on such calls, being friendly and conversational, the last
>thing an offender would want to deal with.  This gives them time
>to get familiar with the voice and personality too.  I believe
>this would be a significant hurdle to the typical offender.
>
>
>- Don

Actually, your phone idea is good as well. At the moment, we do not appear to
have such a problem with anonymous offenders (with the exception of me), so none
of these extreme measures appear to be required. It's just a good idea to give
suggestions when we think of them so that ICD can have a pool of ideas to work
with.

KarinsDad :)



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