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Subject: Re: How long to see black is winning + crafty bench

Author: Mike Byrne

Date: 08:48:06 03/27/05

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On March 27, 2005 at 11:40:03, Vincent Lejeune wrote:

>On March 27, 2005 at 11:36:34, Mike Byrne wrote:
>
>>On March 27, 2005 at 11:18:35, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>>
>>>On March 27, 2005 at 10:24:52, Mike Byrne wrote:
>>>
>>>>On March 27, 2005 at 06:56:35, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 21:30:04, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 19:46:58, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:34:45, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:29:42, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:20:17, Mike Byrne wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>after the main line :  Kf2 f5 h3 Kc7 g3 hxg3 is winning no?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Black(2): his
>>>>>>>>>>    white       black
>>>>>>>>>>  1  Kf2         f5
>>>>>>>>>>  2  h3          Kc7
>>>>>>>>>>  3  g3          ...
>>>>>>>>>>               17    25.52  -7.17   3. ... hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 f4+ 5. Kg4 b6
>>>>>>>>>>                                    6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3 gxh4 8. c6 Kxc6 9.
>>>>>>>>>>                                    Kg4 b5 10. a5 b4 11. Kxh4 Kb5 12. Kg4
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>In this line, Yace says 8. c6? is losing, while 8.cxb6 is draw.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>It is such an obvious blunder, that it looks like a bug in Crafty.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>>>Dieter
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Probably a bug in the static eval of the pawn endgame. after 3 min@3 Ghz :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I can't reproduce Mikes PV with this "c6 bug"...  I don't get c6 at any point
>>>>>>that I can see, it always takes...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Any ideas?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I succeded to replicate c6 as best move :
>>>>>1) without any EGTB
>>>>>2) starting with this position 8/1p1k4/5p2/2Pp2p1/P2P3p/8/6PP/6K1 w - - 0 1
>>>>>3) under chessbase interface
>>>>>4) played 1. Kf2 f5 2. h3 Kc7 3. g3 hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 with 5 between each move
>>>>>5) the score is rising for white but it so long I stopped
>>>>>Is it a problem related to only pawns endgame eval or linked to hashtables too ?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I suggest not to test under Chessbase GUI unless you are using the native
>>>>chessbase crafty engine.
>>>
>>>I use the native chessbase crafty engine.
>>
>>after Kxg3 above, you should see a draw score -- Crafty output from a console
>>window is below  - anything else and something is broken -- in my case it was
>>bad kppkp egtb.  I would contact Chessbase since they compiled thenative
>>chessbase Crafty.
>>
>>White(4): Kxg3
>>analyze.White(4): White(4): Kxg3
>>              clearing hash tables
>>              time surplus   0.00  time limit 10:00 (10:00)
>>              depth   time  score   variation (1)
>>                9     0.05  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 b6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. cxb6+ Kxb6 9. Kg4 Ka5 10. Kxh4
>>                                    Kxa4 (s=3)
>>                9->   0.08  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 b6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. cxb6+ Kxb6 9. Kg4 Ka5 10. Kxh4
>>                                    Kxa4
>>               10     0.10  -0.82   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 Ke7 9. a5 Ke6 10. Kxh4
>>               10->   0.11  -0.82   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 Ke7 9. a5 Ke6 10. Kxh4
>>               11     0.14  -0.72   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    h4 f3 8. Kxf3 gxh4 9. Kg4 Ke7 10. Kxh4
>>               11->   0.16  -0.72   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    h4 f3 8. Kxf3 gxh4 9. Kg4 Ke7 10. Kxh4
>>               12     0.22  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    c6 Kc7 8. cxb7 Kxb7 9. h4 f3 10. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 11. Kg4 Ka6 12. Kxh4 Kxa5
>>               12->   0.25  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    c6 Kc7 8. cxb7 Kxb7 9. h4 f3 10. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 11. Kg4 Ka6 12. Kxh4 Kxa5
>>               13     0.33  -0.60   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    Kf3 Kc7 8. Kg2 Kb8 9. Kf2 Ka7 10. c6
>>                                    bxc6 11. Kf3
>>               13->   0.43  -0.60   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>>                                    Kf3 Kc7 8. Kg2 Kb8 9. Kf2 Ka7 10. c6
>>                                    bxc6 11. Kf3
>>               14     0.58     +1   4. ... f4+
>>               14     0.78  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               14->   0.89  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               15     1.05  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               15->   1.18  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>>               16     1.49  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               16->   1.80  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>>               17     2.60  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               17->   3.11  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>>               18     4.30  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               18->   5.47  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>>               19     8.07  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               19->  11.30  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>>               20    18.07  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>>                                    <EGTB>
>>               20    24.85    8/9?  4. ... g4
>
>I succeded to replicate c6 as best move :
>1) without any EGTB
>2) starting with this position 8/1p1k4/5p2/2Pp2p1/P2P3p/8/6PP/6K1 w - - 0 1
>3) under chessbase interface
>4) played 1. Kf2 f5 2. h3 Kc7 3. g3 hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 with 5 seconds between each
>move (?)

somthing is broken - what else can I say ...it's not in Crafty's source



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