Author: blass uri
Date: 23:30:10 03/28/99
Go up one level in this thread
On March 28, 1999 at 20:34:41, Paulo Soares wrote: >On March 28, 1999 at 19:01:19, James T. Walker wrote: > >>On March 28, 1999 at 13:54:58, blass uri wrote: >> >>> >>>On March 28, 1999 at 13:46:49, José de Jesús García Ruvalcaba wrote: >>> >>>>On March 28, 1999 at 13:30:30, blass uri wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>>On March 28, 1999 at 13:19:16, José de Jesús García Ruvalcaba wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On March 28, 1999 at 05:46:46, blass uri wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>I looked in gambitsofrt forum >>>>>>>and I found that Junior5 won Wchess2000 in mclane's tournament >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Junior got a drawn KQP vs KQ >>>>>>> >>>>>>>8/8/6Q1/3p4/1K1k4/8/8/7q b - - 0 1 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Junior5 did not use tablebases and played Qe1+ >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Junior5 won after a mistake of wchess2000 (Kb5) >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Tablebases tell Junior5 to play Ke3? Qg5+ Ke2 and black is losing the pawn after >>>>>>>Kc5. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Uri >>>>>> >>>>>> That is what I call poor tablebase handling. Tablebases should never decrase >>>>>>playing strength when they are probed at the root. Is this a problem of Junior? >>>>>>or has something to do with the tablebases? >>>>> >>>>>No, it is a problem of Fritz5 >>>>>Junior is using tablebases of Fritz5 in the ssdf games and it is not fair. >>>>> >>>>>The original Junior5 does not use tablebases. >>>>> >>>>>Uri >>>> >>>> I do not understand the strange relationship between Junior5 and Fritz5. Could >>>>you please elaborate? Why does Junior use Fritz's tablebases? Is it being >>>>handicapped by Fritz's poor tablebase handling? >>> >>>I asked the ssdf guys about this and I told them that I think that it should not >>>use the tablebases and Amir Ban replied that it is impossible to use the >>>autoplayer for Junior5 without the tablebases of Fritz5(In the Fritz5 CD). >>> >>>chessbase is quilty about this strange relationship. >>> >>>I believe that Junior5 is handicapped by Fritz's poor tablebase handling but I >>>am not sure about it because the tablebases can sometimes be productive . >>> >>>Uri >> >>Hello Uri, >>It's a simple matter of clicking the "Use endgame CD" box under the "Load >>engine" menu which is under the "Levels" menu to turn the endgame CD off or on. >>The CD has to be in the tray to run auto232 but it does not have to be used for >>endgame play. Also you can click the "Engine choice" box under "Engines" menu >>which is also under the "Levels" menu to turn off the endgame CD ROM. Also I >>have seen Junior 5 win games because of the endgame CD ROM so I doubt if it >>makes much difference. Also it is no more of Fritz's problem than it is Junior >>5 or Nimzo 99's problem. It is the CD ROM's problem since all three have the >>problem while using the CD ROM. >>I still think Junior 5 and Nimzo 99 should not use the CD ROM because it is not >>a part of the package and the programs run fine without it. As I said they need >>that CD to use the auto232 but that's all. >>Jim Walker > > >Jim, > >I tested the position with Fritz5.32( Version March/99, >with tablebases), see below: > >1... Ke3 2. Qb6+ d4 3. Qe6+ Kd2 4. Qf7 d3 5. Qg7 >Kc1 6. Qe5?? (6. Qa1+ Wins.). You are right the tablebases of Fritz know about win for the weaker side only if the weaker side can win by capture. It is usually the case so I did not notice it. In this position the tablebases show Qh5 instead of Qc8#(Qc8# is in the moves but not the first move) I see that the results in the tablebases of Fritz5 are probably based on thompson's tablebases also in KQP vs KQ Uri
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