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Subject: Re: Fritz endgame CD

Author: James T. Walker

Date: 05:38:23 03/30/99

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On March 30, 1999 at 05:24:39, Sylvain Renard wrote:

>>>I found a position when Junior (using tablebases) goes wrong in the winning side
>>>of KRP vs KR
>>>6R1/7k/5P2/8/8/8/7r/K7 w - - 0 1
>>>Fritz's tablebases show the right winning move 1.f7 (8) (I do not understand
>>>8) but after this move the tablebases show for black Rf2 with draw.
>  Yes, good work! But this is kind of error is easy to understand
>because on Fritz CD ROM there are the Ken Thompson's files : Pr_r.g,
>Rb_r.g, Rn_r.g but the file Rr_r.g is missing. After 1...Rf2, the only
>winning move is 2.f8R!! all other moves lead to a draw.
>
>>At that point white has a "Won" endgame and abandons the CD ROM because it
>>believes the program can win the game from there.
>No it is because it does not have the good file on the CD! The file Rr_r.g
>is missing.
>
>>Yes, this is an error in the tablebase.
>Because it is uncomplete.
>
**********
Hello Sylvain,
I don't think the missing tablebase should matter !  If your tablebase would
simply tell your program to promote to a Rook from that point on it is a won
game and no tablebases are needed.  The error in the tablebase is in not
promoting to a rook.  When it promotes to a bishop it is drawn.  That is the
error.  Most any program can win  2 rooks vs 1 rook or KR vs K.
Jim Walker
**************


>>>I am not sure about the result of 2.f8Q, the only question is if black has a
>>>perpetual check and I did not analyze this position and did not check it with
>>>KQR vs KR tablebases.
>If you have Ken Thompson CD N°1 (and for instance ChessBase) you
>can check it's a draw.
>
>>Yes, I believe the 2. f8=Q is a draw because of moves like Ra2+.
>>Jim Walker
>It is confirmed both by Ken Thompson database (when complete...)
>and Edward's tablebases (and human thinking too!).
>
>My program Capture uses Edward's tablebases. It plays 1.f7 and
>announces mate in 20 moves. I have also checked that after
>1.f7 Rf2 2.f8Q?? it plays 2...Ra2+ and announces a draw.
>
>  Best regards,
>Sylvain Renard



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