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Subject: Re: CCC Retirement

Author: Stuart Cracraft

Date: 10:40:33 01/14/06

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On January 14, 2006 at 03:42:21, Walter Faxon wrote:

>On January 14, 2006 at 01:21:08, Dann Corbit wrote:
>
>>On January 14, 2006 at 01:09:25, Stuart Cracraft wrote:
>>
>>>On January 14, 2006 at 00:51:30, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>>
>>>>On January 14, 2006 at 00:13:03, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>One note...
>>>>>
>>>>>If you look around, 90% of the people that stop participating in actual computer
>>>>>chess discussions are those that chose to go "commercial".  Or those that chose
>>>>>to do something after lurking here for quite a while, then go off and become
>>>>>ultra-secretive.  The other 10% either would like to go commercial, but don't,
>>>>>or they just "burn out."  Burn-out is fairly common.  I can only think of one
>>>>>person that is still active that was around when I started competing in CC
>>>>>events.  Me.  Why I didn't "burn out" I have no idea.  And I haven't done so to
>>>>>date either...
>>>>>
>>>>>The ones of us still releasing source code, or even if we are not, we still
>>>>>choose to "hold nothing back" _still_ continue to discuss computer chess ideas.
>>>>>I've been quieter than usual, because I have been busier than usual here at UAB,
>>>>>and also because of the major changes being made in Crafty to get ready for the
>>>>>next WCCC.  But eventually, everything I have been doing will become public, and
>>>>>that will continue so long as I am able to continue doing this stuff, hopefully
>>>>>for many years yet to go...
>>>>>
>>>>>Remember that it is just as reasonable to _start_ a thread on some CC topic as
>>>>>it is to wait for others to start it, and then jump in.  In the past few years,
>>>>>many have chosen to "go commercial" and that ends their participation in
>>>>>technical discussions.
>>>>>
>>>>>That is sad, but it happens.  Fortunately there are still a few around that will
>>>>>continue to discuss things, and continue to push themselves (and the silent
>>>>>lurkers) forward year by year.  One simply has to decide whether to be an active
>>>>>participant or just a lurker...
>>>>
>>>>Sometimes, they also get rejuvenated.  I think Bruce Moreland may be picking up
>>>>interest again.
>>>>
>>>>When Ed Schroder retired from computer chess, he gave detailed instructions on
>>>>how to write a good program on his web site.  He was often helpful with advice
>>>>even when he was programming.
>>>>
>>>>I think in Christophe Theron's case, he discovered a beautiful woman and found
>>>>out that they can be a lot more fun than even chess (drat!)
>>>>
>>>>I also think that the academic endeavor is the best approach in the long haul.
>>>>
>>>>I think that going professional would probably also take all or most of the fun
>>>>out of chess programming.
>>>
>>>I don't put myself at any of their levels, but I did go away for a year,
>>>and, with Don Beal's, Brian Richardson's, and Dan Homan's help, modify my
>>>program so that it learns piece values from entirely randomized play starting
>>>with all pieces equal to a pawn and no other evaluation knowledge besides
>>>material. I am currently working on modifying it to do the same for non-material
>>>pieces and encountering surprising resistance in the code.
>>>
>>>Brian convinced me to come back here and take a look at the goings-on and I am
>>>it is all about Rybka and Fruit - two remarkable programs. I bought Rybka and
>>>I downloaded Fruit. I've played one game against Rybka and briefly looked
>>>at Fruit code enough that I know I still don't want to review another
>>>programmer's code (in any application area) for any reason.
>>>
>>>I miss some of the longer discussions on computer chess programming but sobeit.
>>>
>>>Threads on the subject seem to die faster now here, but perhaps that's just a
>>>misperception.
>>
>>I've been here a long time.  It goes in waves.  A lot of the programmers split
>>time at the Winboard forum now, and I think that takes up a lot of their energy.
>
>
>There is a good reason for that.  A programming thread here drifts off page one
>in a day or so.  In a week they're only available in the archives, if at all.
>But at the WinBoard forum (just checked) some topics go back for more than a
>year.
>
>I guess I just convinced myself to spend more time there.
>
>-W

Where is this Winboard forum?

Also - why haven't they turned to Arena?

Arena doesn't have ability to play a program on ICS/FICS automatically?

Stuart



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