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Subject: Re: Pawn Majorities - an alternative (?)

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 07:04:22 09/18/99

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On September 17, 1999 at 22:31:57, Will Singleton wrote:

>On September 17, 1999 at 12:33:46, KarinsDad wrote:
>
>>Robert,
>>
>>A very difficult problem to resolve.
>>
>>Maybe the best solution is to not resolve it heavily at all (i.e. only resolve
>>it to the level you already have or maybe slightly moreso).
>>
>>In my program, I am attempting to make positional moves over tactical moves.
>>
>>So, I have multiple tactically sound PVs which I decide between. One of the
>>criteria that can be used to decide between them is to determine pawn structure
>>at the leaves of each "PV". If you had 30 different pawn structure "ideas" in a
>>database (or hardcoded), you could have a preset evaluation for each of these
>>structures (i.e. 3 white queenside pawns vs. 2 black queenside pawns where the
>>black pawns are doubled is one pawn structure "idea").
>>
>>You could then use this "evaluation" to positively or negatively affect the
>>decision on which PV to choose (or at least I can do this in my code, you would
>>have to change Crafty drastically to implement this type of model).
>>
>>Hence, if I have 5 PV scores all within 1/8th pawn of each other, I could pick
>>one which SHOULD result in a favorable pawn structure within the next 16 ply as
>>opposed to one which might not.
>>
>>And, the other advantage of this model is that most of this pawn evaluation
>>"stuff" is handled just a few times for each "PV" just before deciding on a move
>>as opposed to within the evaluation code for every node that gets evaluated.
>>Hence, it could be relatively sophisticated (i.e. it could even take into
>>account things such as how advanced the pawns are) and still not take a lot of
>>time.
>>
>>So, the basic idea is to avoid queenside majorities and other endgame weaknesses
>>if possible much earlier in the game. If I have two PVs of similar score, one
>>which should result in a queenside majority for my opponent and one which should
>>not, I pick the one which should not in order to avoid the potential weakness on
>>move 13 as opposed to attempting to evaluate it at move 45. Of course, this type
>>of solution will not work in all positions, but it should emulate better human
>>strategic play as opposed to purely tactical play (i.e. attempt to avoid the
>>pitfalls and cliffs before the position starts heading towards them). Part of
>>the "plan" is to give the program's side the best pawn structure it can way
>>before getting to the endgame.
>>
>>Just an alternative idea.
>>
>>KarinsDad :)
>
>So, as I understand it, you are suggesting that the time it takes to generate 2
>complete pv's (or more) is less than incorporating a pawn structure eval in a
>normal (single pv) eval.
>
>It would seem to me that in order to get 2 good pv's to the same depth would
>require twice the time as one pv.  Of course, I'm on my second vodka & tonic, so
>maybe I'm missing something.
>
>Will


Remember that KD's program apparently isn't based on a traditional iterated
alpha/beta search as we know it.  He seems to be trying something more
selective, and maybe more of a best-first search rather than a traditional
depth-first search...



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