Author: James T. Walker
Date: 10:12:35 10/10/99
Go up one level in this thread
On October 10, 1999 at 10:55:20, blass uri wrote: >On October 10, 1999 at 10:07:11, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On October 10, 1999 at 03:22:13, Harald Faber wrote: >> >>>On October 10, 1999 at 03:14:10, Ed Schröder wrote: >>> >>>>PB-ON vs PB-OFF (results experiment-1) >>>> >>>>To enrich the discussion about the value of the "Permanent Brain" (PB) I >>>>have started 2 experiments with Rebel Century (RC) which will give some >>>>data for a better judgement. >>>> >>>>Experiment-1: >>>>RC (PB=ON) vs RC (PB=OFF) >>>>100 auto232 games >>>>Time control: 60 secs average. >>>>Hardware: 4xPII-266 + 2xPII-450 >>>>Result: 61-39 >>>> >>>>Experiment-2: >>>>RC (PB=ON) vs RC (PB=OFF) >>>>100 auto232 games >>>>Time control: RC (PB=ON) 30 sec average >>>>Time control: RC (PB=OFF) 60 sec average >>>>Hardware: 4xPII-266 + 2xPII-450 >>>>Status: in progress >>>> >>>>Ed Schroder >>> >>>Sorry Ed, but where is the sense in it? Is there any difference than playing >>>Rebel10-Rebel9 which is also meaningless? >>>Would you expect a result of 50-50 when both playing PB=on or both PB=off? I >>>wouldn't. >>>I think the most interesting idea is to take Rebel+PB=on against another program >>>with PB=on and as comparison play the same match with both PB=off. Of course you >>>can extend this to Rebel+PB-vs-Opp X PB=off and Rebel PB=off vs Opp X PB=on. >>> >>>But Rebel vs Rebel, sorry, there is really no sense in it. >> >> >>It is the perfect way to find out what PB is worth with no other degrees of >>freedom in the experiment. Different programs would break the experiment as >>you start off with two variables, (a) program characteristics and (b) PB on/off. >> >>using two programs is an ok idea, but this approach does highlight the >>difference between PBon and PBoff pretty clearly. > >I believe that using one program does the difference bigger not only because the >probability to guess the opponent's move is higher. > >PB=off against PB=on is similiar to some hardware advantage and >playing the same program against itself when one side has hardware advantage is >more productive to the hardware advantage when you use the same program. > >If you use different programs with the same rating on equal hardware then >hardware advantage is less dominant relative to playing the same program against >itself. > >Uri Hello Uri, I have played several hundred games of Hiarcs/Hiarcs and Fritz/Fritz and JUnior/Junior on PII-333 vs K6-3-450. I have also of course played many games of the programs playing vs each other using the same hardware. My statistics show about a 40 point advantage for the K6-3 overall. I noticed no major difference in Programs vs themselves compared to programs vs others. Of course the speed difference is only about 35% but some programs gain as much as 45-50% on the K6-3. Others gain the 35% only. What you are talking about is probably less than 10-15 points. Ed's experiment showed a difference of about 80 points. Jim Walker
This page took 0 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.