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Subject: Re: Mathematical limit forced by K. D. 's position vice. Any formal proofs?

Author: KarinsDad

Date: 15:41:28 10/22/99

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On October 22, 1999 at 15:44:26, Dann Corbit wrote:

>For instance:
>http://www.treasure-troves.com/math/Chess.html
>gives three different estimates of:
>10^120 (I'd say this is pretty well blown out of the water!)
>10^43 (with derivation!)
>10^40 (probably from Hakmem below)
>
>HAKMEM says:
>PROBLEM 95:
>Solve chess. There are about 10^40 possible positions; in most of them, one side
>is hopelessly lost.

Well, my algorithm puts the ballpark at approximately 10^48. When I look at it,
I come to the conclusion that the range of possible legal positions is probably
between 10^46 and 10^48 and not anywhere near 10^43. Also, I know for a fact
that a 164 bit compression can be done without breaking a sweat (with no
possibility of error), so the number of legal positions MUST be under 2.34e49.

My reasoning for the 10^46 to 10^48 range is distorted, but it is as follows:

 1 bit side to move
64 bit bitboard

That leaves 96 bits for the 32 pieces or exactly 3 bits per piece (from 161 bits
and not including location). Now, this is very interesting since 3 bits
represents color and 4 types of pieces, not color and 6 types of pieces (which
is what we find on the chessboard). This means that the compression algorithms
are capable of effectively representing 6 piece types (plus states) into 4 piece
types. To me, that is fairly significant. I cannot comprehend a significant
increase in the compression rate. However, a lot of these positions have to be
illegal ones. But, even if the illegal positions outnumbered the legal positions
4 to 1 (which I doubt since that is a high ratio), it would only drop the
2.92e48 number to 5.85e47. Now granted, I am not taking into account the large
number of positions that can be stored in less than 161 bits via the algorithm,
but I truly wonder how much that drops the value (a factor of 3?, a factor of
10?, a factor of 100?). It's hard to say, but maybe some mathematician can
figure it out someday.

KarinsDad :)

PS. I have been thinking about an interesting mechanism to drop out the illegal
positions. However, that would require a totally different type of algorithm and
would throw most of my previous work out the door. Guess I won't work on that
until after I publish my first algorithm.



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