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Subject: Re: SSDF Rating Irregularities

Author: Ed Schröder

Date: 10:26:05 12/13/99

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On December 13, 1999 at 10:12:21, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On December 13, 1999 at 05:44:37, Ed Schröder wrote:
>
>>>Posted by Robert Hyatt on December 12, 1999 at 10:19:26:
>>
>>>>>But it clearly isn't doing _nearly_ as well vs humans (even with anti-human on)
>>>>>as it is doing against other programs...
>>>>
>>>>Do you have some game examples that supports your strong judgement?
>>>>
>>>>Ed
>>
>>
>>>Somebody else already posted a really bad result vs a humaon on FICS (winning
>>>1/3, losing 2/3, against a player that isn't a "master" of anything but anti-
>>>computer chess.  I have watched "other" players (not often as I don't watch
>>>very often, except when crafty/scrappy is idle) also cause problems...  This
>>>is the most striking example of comp-vs-comp strength being _far_ different
>>>than comp-vs-human strength that I recall in recent years...
>>
>>This specific case wasn't an issue of playing strength but time-control which
>>in the meantime is corrected.
>>
>>I am still waiting for the game examples that supports your judgement.
>>
>
>
>Keep waiting.  I looked thru several 'shutka' games.  In a couple time was the
>problem, but if you look carefully, _many_ games were _not_ lost on time.  They
>were lost OTB.  However, I hardly consider it my job to point out where it is
>playing poorly in the endgame or whatever (oops, almost said too much already).
>Just don't make the mistake of thinking that this was 60 losses on time, 30
>wins OTB.  That wasn't the case _at all_.
>
>
>
>
>>
>>>But as I mentioned before, remember that "I am 10 years behind the commercial
>>>programs".  I don't see any reason to point out the weaknesses of someone that
>>>is 10 years ahead of me, wouldn't you agree?  But, in fact, the problems are
>>>very obvious, so my analysis isn't needed anyway...
>>
>>It took me some time to figure what you are talking about. A few short remarks:
>>a) it wasn't said that way, b) action forces reaction, c) let's live in peace.
>>
>>
>>>Fixing the problems is going to adversely affect its currently great
>>>anti-computer style of play, however...
>>
>>Oh come on.
>>
>>Ed
>
>
>No "oh come on" here.  It needs knowledge in a few significant places.  I know
>of no way to implement this kind of knowledge without losing significant speed.
>And that is going to make a difference in how it plays against computers.  The
>"holes" will become apparent after playing a few IM/GM players...  Right now I
>have not seen it ever refuse to win a pawn, given the chance.  Which might be
>the perfect strategy against computers.  But against some GM/IM players I know,
>it is asking for trouble.  _particularly_ at fast time controls, which is how
>most programs get used...

We will see. The very first game Tiger played against a GM it won. I would
certainly call that a good start.

I am working on a decisive match against Lithunia. 6 boards. 2xGM and 4xIM
hopefully. Tiger will play on 2 boards.

Ed



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