Author: Amir Ban
Date: 15:50:58 01/19/00
Go up one level in this thread
On January 19, 2000 at 17:53:24, Bertil Eklund wrote: >On January 19, 2000 at 17:23:13, Amir Ban wrote: > >>On January 19, 2000 at 13:01:19, Christophe Theron wrote: >> >>>On January 18, 2000 at 16:35:35, Dave Gomboc wrote: >>> >>>>On January 18, 2000 at 16:30:15, Christophe Theron wrote: >>>> >>>>>On January 18, 2000 at 10:32:51, Enrique Irazoqui wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>I noticed that sometimes Tiger keeps playing the same losing opening lines. In >>>>>>the match Tiger-Hiarcs, games 6 and 10 are D10 openings, identical until 14... >>>>>>e6, where Hiarcs shows an evaluation of 0.82 from its point of view. Tiger lost >>>>>>them both. Games 17 and 19 were A45 lines that immediately out of book Hiarcs >>>>>>evaluated as 0.57 in its favor. Again, Tiger lost both games. It seems that >>>>>>there is a learner problem that will allow Tiger to play repeatedly the same >>>>>>losing lines. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>You are right Enrique. This is not a bug, I would rather call it a design flaw. >>>>> >>>>>I have written a simple learning algorithm because I did not want to invest too >>>>>much time in it. In fact I had almost no time to invest, so I have done my best >>>>>in a very tight schedule. >>>>> >>>>>My philosophy has always been to put my efforts on the real stuff: the engine >>>>>itself. >>>>> >>>>>But I'll have to work harder on the learning system, because as you have heard >>>>>recently, Junior6 is badly taking advantage of this (I have heard it has >>>>>repeated TWELVE TIMES the same won opening in one of the SSDF matches). :( >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Christophe >>>> >>>>Looks like you'll be doing some comp-comp testing in the future. Welcome to the >>>>Core Wars saga. >>>> >>>>Dave >>> >>> >>>Not necessarily. All I need is a learning algorithm that really knows how to >>>avoid playing the same lost game twice, and maybe tries from time to time to >>>replay a won game. That does not imply I'm going to buy 10 computers and let >>>them play auto232 matches all day. >>> >>>Anyway I don't have enough money for that. >>> >>> >>> Christophe >> >>The easiest defense against learners is to put a random element in your search >>engine. If you think about it, that's not very different from what a wide book >>would do for you. >> >>I think this can solve about 80% of the problem. The 100% solution is to have a >>good book and a good learner. >> >>Amir > >Hi! > >Not in the games against your program, in fact Tiger played different in almost >all of the 12 losses, but I think it was lost after the first own move after the >opening, the other move it thought of for a long time, I think was equally bad. >The only move that was correct weakened the pawns and I guess Tiger have a very >high penality-score for this. > >Bertil You mean Tiger played the same opening 12 times in 20 games it had the color in this match ? Even a tiny book would give more variation. A learning opponent can't make you to repeat an opening line. It chooses the moves for one side only ! What was the opening line ? Amir
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