Author: Laurence Chen
Date: 17:08:41 04/09/00
Go up one level in this thread
Thanks for your output. Your data demonstrates that Fritz 6 has some kind of bug
when accessing the tablebases. But it managed to win. Perhaps, Robert Hyatt can
explain or someone, I always thought when a chess engine accesses tablebases and
finds a distant mate in XX moves, it will play the best move to mate. Fritz 6a
shows a very odd behavior, as seen the score of the game provided below, it
plays moves which extends the mate, noticed that from move 100 to 105, the mate
announcement keep jumping up and down between mate in 16 and 17. I take this to
be a bug in the Fritz 6a. I don't see this kind of behavior in my other chess
engines. So what's your opinion?
Laurence
On April 09, 2000 at 18:35:56, Mark Young wrote:
>On April 09, 2000 at 14:25:53, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On April 09, 2000 at 12:18:49, Mark Young wrote:
>>
>>>On April 09, 2000 at 11:55:03, Laurence Chen wrote:
>>>
>>>>Without the 5 men tablebases, only using the 3 and 4 men tablebases, Fritz 6a
>>>>plays the endgame correctly. Thus, it seems that Fritz 6a uses the 5 men
>>>>tablebases incorrectly. Bummer !!!
>>>
>>>I have the 5 men tablebases, and it worked on my system.
>>
>>
>>do you have _all_ or _some_? There are 7.5 gigs of compressed 5 piece
>>tables available. The two of you might easily be testing with different
>>ones available.
>
>I had other moves that were different then the one laurence's fritz 6 would
>play, but I will give the mistake that took away the win for fritz 6a and show
>what my system would have played. 87... Kh5 {0.00/47 0} Played by Laurences
>fritz 6 leads to a draw, but my fritz 6 refused to play his and instead played
>the winning move Rb4+ with a mate in 30.
>
>[Event "?"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "????.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "New position"]
>[Black "?"]
>[Result "0-1"]
>[SetUp "1"]
>[FEN "8/8/2R5/1r6/5Kpk/8/8/8 b - - 0 87"]
>[PlyCount "67"]
>
>87... Rb4+ {-#30/1 3} 88. Ke3 {-#30/1 1} 88... Kh3 {-#29/1 0} 89. Rh6+ {
>-#29/1 0} 89... Kg2 {-#28/1 0} 90. Rh4 {-#28/1 0} 90... Rb3+ {-#27/1 0} 91. Ke2
>{-#27/1 0} 91... g3 {-#26/1 0} 92. Rh5 {-#26/1 0} 92... Ra3 {-#25/1 0} 93. Rg5
>{-#24/1 1} 93... Kg1 {-#24/1 0} 94. Rc5 {-#23/1 1} 94... g2 {-#23/1 0} 95. Rh5
>{-#23/1 0} 95... Ra4 {-#22/1 0} 96. Rh7 {-#21/1 0} 96... Ra5 {-#21/1 1} 97. Rg7
>{-#20/1 0} 97... Rh5 {-#20/1 0} 98. Kf3 {-#19/1 0} 98... Rh2 {-#19/1 0} 99. Ke4
>{-#18/1 0} 99... Kh1 {-#18/1 0} 100. Kd5 {-#17/1 0} 100... Rh5+ {-#16/4 1} 101.
>Ke4 {-#16/1 1} 101... Rh4+ {-#16/4 1} 102. Kf5 {-#16/1 1} 102... Rh5+ {
>-#16/1 11} 103. Kf6 {-#16/1 4} 103... Rh6+ {-#17/4 5} 104. Kf5 {-#17/1 1}
>104... g1=Q {-#16/1 1} 105. Rxg1+ {-#17/1 1} 105... Kxg1 {-#16/1 1} 106. Ke5 {
>-#16/1 1} 106... Rh4 {-#15/1 1} 107. Kd6 {-#14/1 1} 107... Kf2 {-#14/1 0} 108.
>Kd5 {-#13/1 0} 108... Ke3 {-#13/1 0} 109. Ke6 {-#12/1 0} 109... Re4+ {-#12/1 0}
>110. Kd6 {-#11/1 0} 110... Kd4 {-#11/1 0} 111. Kc6 {-#11/1 0} 111... Re2 {
>-#10/1 0} 112. Kd6 {-#9/1 0} 112... Kc4 {-#9/1 0} 113. Kc6 {-#8/1 0} 113... Rd2
>{-#8/1 0} 114. Kb6 {-#8/1 0} 114... Rd6+ {-#7/1 0} 115. Kb7 {-#6/1 0} 115...
>Kb5 {-#6/1 0} 116. Kc7 {-#6/1 0} 116... Rd2 {-#5/1 0} 117. Kb7 {-#5/1 0} 117...
>Rc2 {-#4/1 0} 118. Ka8 {-#3/1 0} 118... Ka6 {-#3/1 0} 119. Kb8 {-#3/1 0} 119...
>Kb6 {-#2/1 0} 120. Ka8 {-#2/1 0} 120... Rc8# {-#1/1 0} 0-1
>
>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>>Laurence
>>>>On April 09, 2000 at 11:47:22, Mark Young wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On April 09, 2000 at 09:47:27, Laurence Chen wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>I could not reproduce the draw, Fritz 6a always won.
>>>>>
>>>>>>Here's a position which Fritz 6a played against Rebel-Tiger 12e, and somehow
>>>>>>Fritz 6a blundered away a win to a draw. It played like a drunk in my opinion in
>>>>>>this endgame. It seems to be a major bug in Fritz 6a when accessing the
>>>>>>tablebases. I tested this position with other engines, Junior 6a, Hiarcs 7.32,
>>>>>>Crafty 17.07, and they all played the endgame correctly. I have all the 5 men
>>>>>>tablebase endgame in my hard-drive. And the engines have access to all the
>>>>>>tablebases. Can someone check if this happens also in Fritz 6a?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Position after move 70. Black to move.
>>>>>>[d]8/8/8/2K3p1/3r2P1/4k3/2R5/8 b - - 0 70
>>>>>>
>>>>>>[Event "Level=Blitz:5'+3". "]
>>>>>>[Site "Mississauga"]
>>>>>>[Date "2000.04.08"]
>>>>>>[Round "4"]
>>>>>>[White "Rebel-Tiger 12e"]
>>>>>>[Black "Fritz 6"]
>>>>>>[Result "1/2-1/2"]
>>>>>>[ECO "E19"]
>>>>>>[Annotator "0.37"]
>>>>>>[PlyCount "198"]
>>>>>>[EventDate "2000.04.08"]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>{16384kB, General.ctg. Pentium III 600E
>>>>>>} 1. d4 {0} 1... Nf6 {0} 2. c4 {0}
>>>>>>2... e6 {0} 3. Nf3 {0} 3... b6 {0} 4. g3 {0} 4... Bb7 {0} 5. Bg2 {0} 5... Be7 {
>>>>>>0} 6. O-O {0} 6... O-O {0} 7. Nc3 {0} 7... Ne4 {0} 8. Qc2 {0} 8... Nxc3 {0} 9.
>>>>>>Qxc3 {1} 9... c5 {0} 10. Rd1 {0} 10... d6 {0} 11. b3 {0} 11... Bf6 {0} 12. Bb2
>>>>>>{0} 12... Qe7 {0} 13. Qc2 {1} 13... Nc6 {0} 14. e4 {0} 14... g6 {0} 15. d5 {0}
>>>>>>15... Nb4 {0} 16. Bxf6 {0} 16... Qxf6 {0} 17. Qd2 {0} 17... e5 {0} 18. a3 {11}
>>>>>>18... Na6 {0} 19. Qh6 {last book move 25} 19... Qg7 {0.37/12 13} 20. Qxg7+ {7}
>>>>>>20... Kxg7 {0.31/13 0} 21. Bh3 {10} 21... Kf6 {0.25/12 34} 22. Bd7 {10} 22...
>>>>>>Nb8 {0.12/13 31} 23. Ba4 {16} 23... Ke7 {0.12/12 11} 24. Nh4 {11} 24... f5 {
>>>>>>0.03/13 13} 25. f4 {6} 25... fxe4 {-0.25/12 19} 26. fxe5 {13} 26... dxe5 {
>>>>>>-0.38/12 19} 27. Re1 {16} 27... Kd6 {-0.38/12 8} 28. Rxe4 {6} 28... a6 {
>>>>>>-0.31/12 2} 29. Re3 {4} 29... b5 {-0.06/12 4} 30. cxb5 {7} 30... axb5 {
>>>>>>-0.19/12 9} 31. Bxb5 {11} 31... Bxd5 {-0.19/12 0} 32. Rd1 {6} 32... Nc6 {
>>>>>>0.06/11 1} 33. Bxc6 {8} 33... Kxc6 {0.37/12 0} 34. b4 {8} 34... e4 {0.50/11 0}
>>>>>>35. Rc3 {6} 35... c4 {0.00/12 17} 36. Ng2 {16} 36... Bg8 {0.00/13 0} 37. Rd4 {7
>>>>>>} 37... Rfe8 {0.00/12 7} 38. Ne3 {11} 38... Kb5 {0.00/13 0} 39. Nc2 {8} 39...
>>>>>>Rad8 {0.09/12 10} 40. Kf2 {19} 40... Ka4 {0.00/15 0} 41. Ke3 {4} 41... Bd5 {
>>>>>>0.00/13 3} 42. Rd2 {9} 42... Rf8 {0.00/12 10} 43. Ke2 {0} 43... Bg8 {0.00/12 12
>>>>>>} 44. Nd4 {4} 44... Rde8 {0.00/11 9} 45. Ke1 {5} 45... h6 {0.03/12 27} 46. Re2
>>>>>>{5} 46... Rf6 {-0.09/12 15} 47. Rce3 {5} 47... Rd8 {-0.38/12 9} 48. Rxe4 {9}
>>>>>>48... Rfd6 {-0.47/11 1} 49. Ne6 {24} 49... Bxe6 {-1.22/11 3} 50. Rxe6 {17}
>>>>>>50... Kxa3 {-1.66/13 0} 51. R6e3+ {16} 51... Kxb4 {-1.72/12 6} 52. Rb2+ {1}
>>>>>>52... Kc5 {-1.78/12 9} 53. Ke2 {5} 53... Rd3 {-1.91/12 7} 54. Rxd3 {13} 54...
>>>>>>Rxd3 {-1.81/11 3} 55. Ra2 {9} 55... Rd6 {-2.22/12 6} 56. Ke3 {9} 56... c3 {
>>>>>>-2.53/12 6} 57. Ra7 {4} 57... Kc4 {-2.66/12 2} 58. Rc7+ {3} 58... Kb3 {
>>>>>>-2.78/12 1} 59. Rb7+ {7} 59... Kc2 {-3.03/14 0} 60. Rc7 {16} 60... Rd3+ {
>>>>>>-3.25/12 4} 61. Ke2 {1} 61... Rd2+ {-3.28/12 2} 62. Ke3 {4} 62... Rxh2 {
>>>>>>-3.38/13 0} 63. Rc6 {9} 63... g5 {-3.53/13 0} 64. Kd4 {4} 64... Rd2+ {
>>>>>>-4.13/12 1} 65. Kc4 {9} 65... Rd3 {-4.16/13 0} 66. g4 {14} 66... Kd2 {
>>>>>>-5.66/14 0} 67. Rxh6 {9} 67... c2 {-14.44/11 5} 68. Rh2+ {2} 68... Ke3 {
>>>>>>-15.66/12 0} 69. Rxc2 {3} 69... Rd4+ {-#34/6 0} 70. Kc5 {2} 70... Rxg4 {
>>>>>>-#33/5 0} 71. Kd5 {3} 71... Rd4+ {-#31/4 0} 72. Ke5 {2} 72... Rb4 {-#30/5 0}
>>>>>>73. Rc3+ {4} 73... Kf2 {-#29/5 0} 74. Rc2+ {2} 74... Kg3 {-#28/5 0} 75. Rc3+ {3
>>>>>>} 75... Kh4 {-#27/5 0} 76. Rc6 {2} 76... Rb5+ {-#31/4 0} 77. Ke4 {4} 77... Rb3
>>>>>>{-#30/5 0} 78. Kf5 {12} 78... Rf3+ {-#30/4 0} 79. Ke4 {2} 79... Rf4+ {-#30/4 0}
>>>>>>80. Ke5 {7} 80... Ra4 {-#27/5 0} 81. Kf5 {4} 81... Rf4+ {-#28/4 0} 82. Ke5 {2}
>>>>>>82... Rb4 {-#27/5 0} 83. Kf5 {2} 83... Rb5+ {-#31/4 0} 84. Ke4 {2} 84... g4 {
>>>>>>-#30/5 0} 85. Kf4 {3} 85... Rb4+ {-#29/4 0} 86. Kf5 {2} 86... Rb5+ {-#30/4 0}
>>>>>>87. Kf4 {2} 87... Kh5 {0.00/47 0} 88. Rc8 {3} 88... Rb1 {0.00/47 0} 89. Rh8+ {2
>>>>>>} 89... Kg6 {0.00/47 0} 90. Kxg4 {2} 90... Kf6 {0.00/47 0} 91. Kf3 {3} 91...
>>>>>>Ke5 {0.00/47 0} 92. Re8+ {2} 92... Kd4 {0.00/47 0} 93. Rd8+ {2} 93... Kc5 {
>>>>>>0.00/47 0} 94. Ke4 {2} 94... Ra1 {0.00/47 0} 95. Rd7 {2} 95... Kc6 {0.00/47 0}
>>>>>>96. Rh7 {4} 96... Kd6 {0.00/47 0} 97. Rh6+ {3} 97... Kc5 {0.00/47 0} 98. Rh8 {2
>>>>>>} 98... Rf1 {0.00/47 0} 99. Rh7 {2} 99... Rd1 {0.00/47 0} 1/2-1/2
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