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Subject: Re: Shredder in the SSDF list

Author: Jason Williamson

Date: 01:33:18 04/16/00

Go up one level in this thread


On April 15, 2000 at 23:22:47, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On April 15, 2000 at 13:59:26, Tony Hedlund wrote:
>
>>On April 14, 2000 at 12:54:59, Stefan Meyer-Kahlen wrote:
>>
>>>On April 14, 2000 at 12:46:43, Bertil Eklund wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 14, 2000 at 10:57:27, Stefan Meyer-Kahlen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Yes, I have received about 75 games of Shredder but haven't checked them yet.
>>>>>Some programs really have improved during the last months so I am busy working
>>>>>on Shredder. This is my main target right now, if I have some time left I'll
>>>>>check the games but I don't expect any problems.
>>>>>
>>>>>I give you a recent example of some autoplayer problems. This is part of an
>>>>>email I wrote today. I didn't want to publish it first but it might help here.
>>>>>
>>>>>"You know about the autoplayer and all of its weaknesses, just this morning I
>>>>>had a strange behaviour again. I was playing vs. X when X send the save game
>>>>>command to Shredder 3 times in a row. The result was that Shredder saved the
>>>>>last game 3 times and adjusted the display of the match result according to
>>>>>that. Well, Shredder won, so he got 3 points instead of 1 for the game :-) If
>>>>>you don't look very carefully at all the games played with the autoplayer you
>>>>>can get all sorts of wrong results."
>>>>
>>>>Hi!
>>>>
>>>>As I have told you and mr Weiner several times, we partly follows most games and
>>>>check the results of every game. In example Tony Hedlund is a very good player
>>>>and played in the last Swedish correspondence Championship, Bo Aurell another
>>>>tester played in the Swedish Championship in the sixties and I think they can
>>>>see if there are any anomalies. I don't know what persons that test your
>>>>programs, are they only reporting the scorenumbers? I have now played 122
>>>>tournament games with S4 with only two stops, one game where Hiarcs stopped
>>>>within the opening book and one game where S4 played only one move (1.d4) and
>>>>saved the game as a win for itself, Nimzo saved it as an unexpected end.
>>>>
>>>>So far I can't see what the problem is. S4 has won against Hiarcs and Nimzo and
>>>>looks to crush Tiger (my games). Only one bad loss against F6 a program that
>>>>many people believe is the best for the moment.
>>>>
>>>>If we had been allowed to test S4 when it was new it had probably been number
>>>>one for some time. I believe S4 belongs in the group of Junior6 and Tiger that
>>>>fights for the second place. It looks like Fritz6a have made a big step forward
>>>>and I believe it is the best program for the moment.
>>>>
>>>>I also think that we have been fair against S4 allowing it to use the Turbo-cds,
>>>>that seems to be much more efficient than the original Thomson-CDs.
>>>>
>>>>Bertil
>>>>
>>>>>End of quote.
>>>>>I have just changed the name of the program involved as I don't want to blame
>>>>>anybody.
>>>>>
>>>>>Stefan
>>>
>>>I didn't complain that you have treated Shredder unfair and also don't think so.
>>>For me there is no problem. Also I didn't say storys like the one above happen
>>>at the ssdf. I just wanted to point out that there is so much that can go wrong
>>>using the autoplayer.
>>>
>>>Stefan
>>
>>I must disagree on this. I've played thousands of games with the autoplayer, and
>>I would say that it's very, very little that goes wrong with it.
>>
>>Tony
>
>
>I disagree with your disagreement.  :)
>
>_Any_ piece of software that is dependent on timing delays and such is a piece
>of trash.  It turns the interface into a synchronous operation when it should
>work asynchronously.  trash for an interface.  Compare it to the winboard
>interface that has _no_ timing issues between an engine and the interface...
>No way to lose a message, get multiple copies of the message, etc...
>
>maybe I insulted the trash of the world, when I think about it.  :)

hmm one gets the impression that Bob isn't very fond of autoplayer ;)))



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