Author: Jason Williamson
Date: 00:42:02 04/29/00
Go up one level in this thread
Wow, one of the first sensible posts on this dumb topic. I wish people would stop trolling and leave Bob and Crafty alone. :) Nice post Mr. Dorr. Jason On April 28, 2000 at 11:16:36, Christopher R. Dorr wrote: >I have seen several people post the comment about Crafty's supposed inferiority >to the commercials. I have not seen this. I am a fairly strong player (USCF Life >Master), and play Crafty, Fritz, ChessMaster,and Rebel on a regular basis. >Subjectively, Crafty seems at least as strong as the commercials. I know at >least one other USCF Master who feels the same way. > >Objectively? Well, much of the data that has been posted here is in the form of >'I tested Crafty vs. Fritz in the ChessBase interface and...'. Bob has pointed >out how flawed this is, for a variety of reasons. Additionally, Bob has >optimized Crafty to play against humans. So I think that perhaps we should weigh >results vs. humans quite highly when evaluating the strength of any given >program. > >Crafty has 'put it's money where it's mouth is' by playing on FICS and ICC. >Scrappy has established the highest rating *ever* (human or computer)in ICC by >achieving a blitz rating of 3395 on 4/26/2000, after several thousand games. If >it were so evident that the commercials were superior, do you not think their >owners would simply gain the record over Crafty, and use it for marketing >purposes? I certainly would. It would only be logical. The simple fact is that >in this *universally available* forum, *nobody* has demonstrated a superiority >to Crafty. No humans, no computers. It would be simple to do so, no? If they >truly were superior. > >Now you can say that the commercials have other advantages over Crafty....much >better graphical interfaces (Winboard is nice, but there are better), better >database features (Crafty has none), or better feature sets (Crafty was *just* >designed to play chess)/ But I disagree that one can say that the strength of >Crafty is inferior to the commercials. It all depends on how you choose to >measure it. Crafty on it's optimized platform vs. Fritz6 on it's? Tossup. Crafty >vs. Fritz on the Chessbase interface? Advantage Fritz. Fritz on a Quad Xeon 550 >vs. Crafty on a Quad Xeon 550? Advantage Crafty. Against humans? Against >computers? Who knows. The only simple answer is that (in my opinion) none have >demonstrated some incontovertable claim to be clearly superior to the others, in >part for the reasons I have outlined above. > >Chris Dorr > > >On April 28, 2000 at 00:01:05, Jerry Adams wrote: > >> >> >> Like everyonelse I own crafty but I never play it, Personally I prefer the >>commericial programs much, much better. Not to take anything away from Dr. Bob >>or Crafty, I enjoy watching Crafty play on Icc against Grandmasters, one of my >>favorites there is Singacrafty which I think is one of the few Programs on Icc >>with a "Real Rating", since it will play anyone, it doesn't careful pick it's >>opponents to gain rating points. But let's be reasonable Folks crafty is simply >>not in the same class as fritz, junior and chess tiger.
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