Author: Stefan Meyer-Kahlen
Date: 04:14:21 05/03/00
Go up one level in this thread
On May 03, 2000 at 05:48:33, Paulo Soares wrote:
>On May 03, 2000 at 00:06:39, blass uri wrote:
>
>>On May 02, 2000 at 16:49:25, Pete R. wrote:
>>
>>>I think Shredder's output is basically correct in that Rxe6 is *not* the best
>>>move. After Rxe6 fxe6 is best and leads to the forced line given. Shredder
>>>sees this better than Fritz does, btw, Fritx abandons fxe6 in favor of Rc7.
>>>Somebody mentioned 1. Rxe6 fxe6 2. Bh6?! as being better than 2. Nxe6 but I
>>>disagree. 1. Rxe6 fxe6 2. Bh6 a6 and white is still in poor shape. 1. Bh6 has a
>>>point to keep the king in the center, but 1. Qd3 to prevent a6 may be as good or
>>>better. In any case Shredder seems to be doing fine.
>>
>>I remember that I tried to play the position after Rxe5 fxe6 2.Bh6 with black
>>with the help of my beta version of Junior(Junior4.6 was the commercial version
>>and I used a better version) in this board about 1.5-2 years ago and could not
>>win with black.
>>
>>I am not sure what I played but I think that I played a6 and the opponent
>>replied Re1 at some stage of the game that was a strong move.
>>
>>Uri
>
>I analyzed 1. Rxe6 fxe6 2. Bh6 a6 for a long time, but I didn't get to find any
>position in that white are better. However, I think Howard is right
>when he wrote: "the position was extremely deep and full of twists and
>turns that computers needed a long time to resolve".
>I will seek in the files with approximately 1.5 years to see what you and
>Howard played, I am curious because I am not 100% sure that white
>can't win/draw in this position.
>
>Paulo Soares
I have let Shredder analyse the position after 1.Rxe6 fxe6 a bit. After a while
Shredder switches to 2.Bh6, but the score is still significantly lower that at
the root without playing 1.Rxe6.
Thanks for all your input
Stefan
6.01 0:02.03 +1.74 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kf7 4.Qf3+ Bf6 5.Bg5 Rb8 6.Rd1 Ke7
(223.571) 110.0
6 -> 0:02.06 +1.74 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kf7 4.Qf3+ Bf6 5.Bg5 Rb8 6.Rd1 Ke7
(224.949) 109.0
7.01 0:04.28 +1.49-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Qxe7+ (494.282) 115.4
7.01 0:04.79 +0.99-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Qxe7+ (573.511) 119.5
7.01 0:06.07 +0.82 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Qxe8 (739.209) 121.6
7 -> 0:06.29 +0.82 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Qxe8 (765.290) 121.5
8.01 0:11.54 +0.80 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rcd8 7.Qc6 Qc7 8.Nxd8+ Rxd8 9.Qxc7 Nxc7
(1.376.981) 119.2
8 -> 0:11.65 +0.80 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rcd8 7.Qc6 Qc7 8.Nxd8+ Rxd8 9.Qxc7 Nxc7
(1.391.745) 119.3
9.01 0:24.64 +0.55-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Bh6+ Kxh6 10.Qh3+ Kg5
11.Qg3+ Kf6 12.Qe5+ Kxe5 (2.717.680) 110.2
9.01 0:32.15 +0.05-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.b3 Rxd7 (3.687.498) 114.6
9.01 0:46.23 -0.20 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Qxe8 Nf6 10.Qb8 Rxc1+
(5.350.617) 115.7
9 -> 0:49.75 -0.20 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Qxe8 Nf6 10.Qb8 Rxc1+
(5.747.090) 115.5
10.01 1:47.68 -0.45-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Bh6+ Kxh6 10.Qh3+ Kg5
11.Qh6+ Kxh6 (12.019.946) 111.6
10.01 2:25.21 -0.95-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Ne8+ Rxe8 9.Bh6+ Kxh6 10.Qh3+ Kg5
11.Qh6+ Kxh6 (16.533.198) 113.8
10.01 3:18.28 -1.36 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nxa5 Rxd7 8.Nc6 Rc7 9.Nxe7 Rxe7 10.Bg5 Re5
11.Bh6 (22.759.629) 114.7
10 -> 3:36.00 -1.36 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nxa5 Rxd7 8.Nc6 Rc7 9.Nxe7 Rxe7 10.Bg5 Re5
11.Bh6 (24.620.915) 113.9
11.01 6:50.21 -1.61-- 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nxa5 Rxd7 8.Nc6 Rc7 9.Nxe7 Rxe7 10.b3 Kg7 11.Bg5
(46.176.846) 112.5
11.01 10:45.17 -1.88 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Qb5 Qxb5 9.Nxb5 Rd7 10.Be3 Nxe3
11.fxe3 Rc8 12.Rf1 (71.838.251) 111.3
11 -> 13:25.06 -1.88 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nd6+ Kg7 8.Qb5 Qxb5 9.Nxb5 Rd7 10.Be3 Nxe3
11.fxe3 Rc8 12.Rf1 (88.329.686) 109.7
12.01 27:53.01 -1.93 2.Nxe6 Qa5 3.Bxd7+ Kxd7 4.Nec5+ Ke8 5.Qd7+ Kf7 6.Nxb7
Rc7 7.Nxa5 Rxd7 8.Bh6 Rc8 9.Re1 Kg8 10.Nb3
(182.248.490) 108.9
12.02 36:42.14 -1.92++ 2.Bh6 a6 3.Bxa6 Bxa6 4.Nxe6 Qa5 5.Ng7+ Kf7 6.Qe6+ Kf8
7.Qxd7 Qc7 8.Nf5+ Kf7 9.Qxd5+ Kf6 10.Bg7+
(236.080.207) 107.2
12.02 44:10.84 -1.57++ 2.Bh6 a6 3.Bxa6 Bxa6 4.Nxe6 Qa5 5.Ng7+ Kf7 6.Qe6+ Kf8
7.Qxd7 Qc7 8.Qxd5 (278.298.198) 104.9
12.02 55:46.12 -1.15 2.Bh6 a6 3.Bxa6 Qc7 4.Nxe6 Qc6 5.Bxb7 Qxb7 6.Ng7+ Kf8
7.Re1 Qc6 8.Nf5+ Kf7 9.Nd4 Qxa4 10.Qe6+ (342.851.382)
102.4
12 -> 58:46.01 -1.15 2.Bh6 a6 3.Bxa6 Qc7 4.Nxe6 Qc6 5.Bxb7 Qxb7 6.Ng7+ Kf8
7.Re1 Qc6 8.Nf5+ Kf7 9.Nd4 Qxa4 10.Qe6+ (361.427.969)
102.5
13.01 84:06.04 -1.05 2.Bh6 a6 3.Bxa6 Qc7 4.Nxe6 Qc6 5.Bxb7 Qxb7 6.Ng7+ Kf8
7.Re1 Qc6 8.Nf5+ Kf7 9.Nd4 Qxa4 10.Qe6+ (512.424.766)
101.5
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