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Subject: Re: Possible ICCA tournament structure

Author: Keith Ian Price

Date: 21:13:51 10/24/97

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On October 24, 1997 at 01:48:10, Bruce Moreland wrote:

>I was just talking to Bob, and we came up with the following.  He hasn't
>seen this, so if he has a disagreement, it is my problem not his.
>
>You have three tournaments, you do one each year, in sequence.
>
>1) WCCC.  Open hardware.
>
>2) WMCCC.  Open hardware, size restriction on the computer, and it has
>to be single-processor.  The idea is to give the off-brand machines
>their due.
>
>3) WUPCCC.  Uniform platform (and I personally would hope uniform
>operating system, guess which one).  The idea is to go straight down the
>middle of the PC mainstream and see who can do best on the machine your
>mom just bought at Compu-Whatever with her two thousand bucks.
>
>If someone has an exotic micro platform, you kill everyone in year two,
>but in year three you either port it to x86 and suffer performance
>problems, or you pass that year.
>
>Alternatively, since the WUPCCC would be run on a uniform platform and
>maybe a uniform operating system, someone could write auto-player
>software (not necessarily Donninger's), that would let us play the event
>via remote-control, possibly even extending the tournament to a larger
>number of rounds, or a series of two-game matches each round, or
>whatever.  So perhaps we could do a WUPCCC every year, and have the
>other two events like we do now.

Don't we already have the SSDF for this? I personally think the hoopla
over your Alpha and Bob's is silly. I am interested to see if Crafty
plays significantly better in a 64-bit environment, to decide if an
Alpha would be a worthwhile purchase. If Crafty were to win the
tournament on an Alpha, and CSTal came in 5th on a 200Mhz K6, I would
not think that CSTal was not good enough to buy, as the results of an
eleven round tournament do not indicate anything with enough probability
to decide anything. About the only way someone could score big from the
WMCCC, in my opinion, were if they were amongst the only ones not to
bring their own super hardware, and ran on the supplied hardware, and
still won. I believe this is what Fritz did in '95. But I think it is a
failure to understand the market for high-level chess programs, when
there is this much worry over the hardware. The mass-market programs
could benefit from winning, but the I think on those, the price is still
more telling than the fact they won something. So even if CSTal were to
win the WMCCC,in the mass market people would still buy CM5k for $29,
rather than the WMCCC winner for $60. I would like to ban the 767Mhz
Alphas, since it is unlikely anyone could purchase one if they liked the
play at that level. But then again, it might reveal insights for the
programmers running them on improvements they could make for slower
hardware.

>
>In a year when we couldn't get sponsorship for one of the first two
>events, at least we could have a WUPCCC, since it would easier to
>organize.
>
>bruce

I suppose if it were long enough to be statistically significant, then
it would have an advantage over the SSDF by allowing "lesser" programs
to compete on equal hardware also. But such a long tourney might prove
too tiring for most and would only run once, I fear.

kp



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