Author: Ed Schröder
Date: 22:07:40 11/07/97
Go up one level in this thread
>Posted by Komputer Korner on November 07, 1997 at 13:01:44: >The following was Moritz Berger's response to my complaint about the >subject of Rebel slowing down on my machine with 144Mb of RAM. >"Tecra 710 and up support 144 MB fully cacheable memory, I have one >myself (144 MB, successfully used with Linux, NT, 95, Solaris so far). >Rebel's several year old built-in DOS extender doesn't work on systems >with >64MB via DOS himem.sys and emm386.exe, it will refuse to run if >those are detected because it sees some negative amount of available >XMS memory. On those machines you have to run it without memory >managers, this works well on my other 64MB+ machines (at full speed). I am not so sure if you can blame Rebel's DOS extender for that. Neither I can prove the opposite. There seems to be a lot of problems going on with several types of Pc's today. Complaints about Cyrix and AMD processors and in this specific case (Pc's with more than 64 Mb memory) I quote a posting of Peter Herttrich recently posted here. >> begin quote << Hey Boys, take a look at your motherboard. If you find the INTEL-TX- Chipset, you have a cache-problem. The TX only caches 64MB. This is well known, but every stupid buys this junk. Addon W96 addresses the memory from top to bottom, NT/dos/linux works in the opposite way. Buy a HX chipset or the new Via-apollo-chipset. >> end quote << This is also a perfect explanation what is happening and has nothing to do with Rebel and can slow down other (chess) software as well. Although you came with an explanation and solution for this specific case I am much more careful with final conclusions. I like to point to "Tom's hardware page" at: http://sysdoc.pair.com - Ed Schroder - >On my Toshiba Tecra, Rebel's legacy DOS extender (*without himem.sys >and emm386.exe*) suffers from an unknown bug which will slow down >speed exactly by the same amount as turning off 2nd level cache (but >only on 64MB+ machines!). >The slowdown is always constant, i.e. it doesn't matter how much hash >tables are allocated or how long the search takes. >******* IMPORTANT ****** >It does not occur under Windows 95 in a DOS box, which provides memory >services that simulate a <64 MB machine for the affected DOS programs. >=> solution for KK: >If you have 144 MB, just run Rebel (without W parameter, so you will >get 60 MB HT) under Windows 95. Problem solved. >********* >(KK's comment: Moritz, I think you meant that Rebel should be run in a >DOS box within Win 95. ) >solution for me (cause I need the Auto232 autoplayer which only works >under plain DOS): >I installed a 3rd party DOS extender which lets you limited the size >of available XMS memory. Setting this to e.g. 60 MB will make it >compatible with Rebel's own DOS extender. The product I use is called >386Max 8.0, Qemm doesn't offer a similar feature. >Moritz Berger" >The following is Andy Duplain's explanation. The QUESTION IS WHO IS >RIGHT? >"the tag ram used for the caching can only >> serve the first 64MB; putting more than 64MB in, on a system with such >> limitations, is detremental to all software and O/S's I would have >thought. >Andy Duplain" > >-- >- - >Komputer Korner > >The inkompetent komputer > >If you see a 1 in my email address, take it out before replying. >Please do not email both me and the r.g.c.c. at the same time. I read >all >the postings on r.g.c.c. > >Andy Duplain <duplaina@nospam.bt.co.uk> wrote in article ><63un4b$fgu$1@pheidippides.axion.bt.co.uk>... >> Robert Hyatt wrote in message <63t4g2$tg6@juniper.cis.uab.edu>... >> >Komputer Korner (korner1@netcom.ca) wrote: >> >: The added memory on the Tecra 740CDT is by way of a DIMM module, so in >> that >> >: regard I am ok, but the 2nd point of the inaction of the 256KB L2 >cache >> >: when using more than 64Mb bothers me. >> > >> >this I don't know about. There have been many cases where the chipset >only >> >supported caching the first 64mb, however. Of course, you will play >hell >> >getting Toshiba to admit this, until you disassemble the machine and >prove >> >it to be true. Then you get the "tough luck, that was how it was >> designed." > > >> I think that's the point Robert; the tag ram used for the caching can >only >> serve the first 64MB; putting more than 64MB in, on a system with such >> limitations, is detremental to all software and O/S's I would have >thought. > >> KK: send the laptop to me and I will replace it with a desktop P133 >w/64MB. >> No additional cost. > >> -- >> Andy Duplain, Syntegra, Brighton, UK. >> *** When replying via e-mail, replace "nospam" with "syntegra" ***
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