Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 05:37:11 11/10/97
Go up one level in this thread
On November 09, 1997 at 23:56:48, Robert Sherman wrote:
>On November 09, 1997 at 17:00:03, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On November 09, 1997 at 16:14:30, Robert Sherman wrote:
>>
>>>On November 09, 1997 at 13:50:58, Jack Leverette wrote:
>>>
>>>>Dear Rob Sherman:
>>>>This isn't right. 4. ...Nc6. was move 2.
>>>>I believe the move is 4. .. Nf6.
>>>>
>>>>Yours,
>>>>The AceyMan
>>>
>>>Sorry I typed it in fast from memory. Your right it should be 4....Nf6.
>>>
>>>Robert Sherman
>>
>>I ran this thru Crafty at one minute per move on my P5 notebook. First,
>>here is the annotated game score:
>>
>> 1. e4 e5
>> 2. Nf3 Nc6
>> 3. Bc4 Bc5
>> 4. Nc3 Nf6
>> 5. Nd5 Nxe4
>> {9:+0.70 Nxe4 Qe2 Nxf2 Rf1 Ng4 h3 Nf6 Nxe5 Nxd5 Bxd5}
>> 6. d3 Nxf2
>> {9:+5.24 Nxf2 Qe2 Nxh1 Nxe5 Bf2+ Kd1 Nd4 Qf1 f6 Nxd7
>>Bxd7 Qxh1}
>> 7. Qe2 Nxh1
>> {8:+4.94 Nxh1 Nxe5 Nd4 Nxc7+ Qxc7 Bxf7+ Ke7 Ng6+ Kxf7
>>Nxh8+ Kf8 Qf1+ Kg8 Qxh1 Kxh8}
>> 8. Ng5 O-O
>> {8:-2.14 O-O Qe4 Bf2+ Kd1 Qxg5 Bxg5 b5 Nf6+ gxf6 Bxf7+
>>Rxf7}
>> {8:+5.74 f5 Nf7 Kxf7 Nxc7+ d5 Bxd5+ Kg6 Nxa8 Bf2+ Kd1
>>Qxd5}
>
>Wow! I am surprised at the difference in score here. I have tested this
>game with almost all the top commercial programs (Genius, Mchess, Fritz,
>Rebel etc. and they all pick O-O over f5. While a couple of IM's prefer
>f5. I think this could put an end to DB not playing Qb6 conspiracy
>theory. Very human-like approach of not walking into an attack although
>I don't think your scores are accurate.
depends on your definition of "accurate score". *my* scores don't
reflect
material only, they reflect lots of other things. Particularly if it is
a
O-O type move. I compare safety after O-O with the potential safety
after
O-O-O, and if O-O-O would be much better, then O-O gets a *big* penalty
to
make it want to defer castling. The penalty is proportional to the
difference val(O-O-O) - val(O-O). Without some such trick, a program
will
castle right into an attack because: (a) most programs receive a bonus
for
castling, to make it castle *now* (before it gets into trouble by being
trapped in the center); (b) most programs want to castle *period*, and
if
castling long is difficult, or needs time to prepare, *now* looks
better.
And it can get you crushed...
self-crushed might be a better term...
>> 9. Nxc7 Qxc7
>> {9:+2.57 Qxc7 Qh5 h6 Bxf7+ Kh8 Qg6 Bb4+ Kf1 Ng3+ hxg3
>Odd doesn't walk into an attack but walks into a mate in 6. Again
>Crafty show that it is possible for a computer to be scared of an attack
>but still miss a deep mate.
note this was run for a short time on a P75 notebook. I wasn't really
hot on the trail of deep tactics, rather I was interested in making sure
it wouldn't impale itself on white's attack... I can see what a deeper
search will see if you like...
>
>>Rxf7+ Nxf7+ Kg8 Bxh6}
>> 10. Qh5 h6
>> {9:-2.44 h6 Bxf7+ Kh8 Qg6 Qa5+ Bd2 Bf2+ Ke2 Ng3+ hxg3
>>Qxd2+ Kxd2
>> Be3+ Kxe3 hxg5}
>> 11. Bxf7+ Kh8
>> {12:-Mat05 Kh8 Qg6 Qa5+ c3 Bf2+ Kf1 Ng3+ hxg3 hxg5 Qh5#}
>> 12. Qg6 Qa5+
>> {11:-Mat04 Qa5+ c3 Bf2+ Kf1 Ng3+ hxg3 hxg5 Qh5#}
>> 13. c3 Qxc3+
>> {14:-Mat03 Qxc3+ bxc3 Bf2+ Kd1 hxg5 Qh5#}
>> 14. bxc3 Bf2+
>> {14:-Mat02 Bf2+ Kd1 hxg5 Qh5#}
>> 15. Kd1 Ne7
>> {14:-Mat01 Ne7 Qh7#}
>> {14:-Mat01 hxg5 Qh5#}
>> 16. Qh7#
>>
>>
>>I didn't study it carefully, but black's move 8 seems horrible, castling
>>right into the attack. there is an 8 pawn difference between O-O and
>>f5,
>>although I can't say what would happen at a deeper depth.
>>
>>Where were you wanting Rebel to play a different move? IE everything
>>looks
>>bearable up until it castles into white's pieces...
>
>f5 is better than o-o but castling is bearable. The ?? move is Qxc7
>
>Robert Sherman
"bearable" might be too lax. Black looks to be in serious difficulty
as opposed to his position after deferring and castling long or sticking
in the center and attacking on the kingside...
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