Author: Tony Werten
Date: 04:47:17 07/26/00
Go up one level in this thread
On July 25, 2000 at 20:30:19, Bruce Moreland wrote: >On July 25, 2000 at 00:07:33, Christophe Theron wrote: > >>So now let's see what happened. On his hardware, Tiger was computing only 25,000 >>positions per second. At 15mn/game time control, that means it was computing >>375,000 positions per search in average. >> >>Isn't Deep Blue supposed to compute way faster? I don't remember the numbers. >>Was it 1M nodes per second per chip, or 2M nodes per second? >> >>If it's only 1M nodes per second and it could only use 3/4 of a second for its >>search (the rest being taken by "downloading stuffs into the chip" as Bob said), >>then it's still 750,000 positions per search, twice the number of positions that >>Tiger could compute during its search on P150. >> >> >>So my conclusion is that I have seen nothing special in this match. I have seen >>2 chess programs fighting, the one computing more nodes taking the advantage, >>but certainly not crushing its opponent as some people would like us to believe. >> >>The funny thing is that before playing the match I thought I would be crushed. >>You see, I have been the victim of the propaganda myself... >> >> >>Now if you ask me about the chances of Chess Tiger against Deeper Blue and its >>200 processors at tournament time controls, I simply say that I think that Chess >>Tiger has absolutely no chance. >> >>But against a single chip, I would say that a program like Chess Tiger running >>on current top hardware has its chances. >> >>Remember that in similar circumstances (fast games played in the same hall) >>Rebel won against Deep Blue Junior by 3-0. >> >>And you know what? Given that Deep Blue does no forward pruning, this is NO >>SURPRISE. > >I am not sure what side of this I'm perceived to be on. I don't think that you >can make any conclusions either way about DB, based upon the matches with >Kasparov, and I'll argue with anyone who concludes anything specific, no matter >which side of the argument they are on. I'll argue with Bob and I'll argue with >the "DB sucks" people. > >I should have spoken with you before you went out to play against that thing. >You told me that it was there, I think in order to give me an opportunity to >take a shot at it, and I declined. Here is why I declined. > >I didn't know what was on the other end, and while I would have enjoyed getting >to play against the thing, I figured that there would be no scientific basis in >anything that happened, with the possible exception of a series of losses, which >would have shown that *something* on the other end was strong. It's hard to >mess up and make something that's strong. If my program had done well against >the thing, it could have been because DB is bad, or because DB was configured >poorly, or was designed to play weakly. There would be no way the truth, and so >all the results would have provided is ammunition for future arguments. > >My position regarding DB is that it came to the party, ate all of the best food, >drank all of the alcohol, and left. It was not much of a conversationalist, and >it has made it clear that it will speak to nobody, and I'm not happy about this >display of bad manners. > >I'm not going to dig through its garbage hoping to understand more about it from >reading its shopping lists. > >I am not interested in speculating about the tiny bit of evidence that exists, >so as far as I'm concerned the thing doesn't exist and isn't worth talking >about, certainly as long as they snub our field while taking its honors. The >project is not science and it's not competition, it was just a well-financed PR >gimmick, and that's shit and I'm not going to let it mess up my life. > >People who wait 20 years for Bobby Fischer to come back are pitiful. I'm sure >not going to do that here. Completely agree. Current elo of DB ? 0.0 It isn't playing anymore, therefor it can't beat any program. Any program is stronger than DB. My program is even stronger. It will not loose against Euwe, Capablanca and a lot more former worldchampions. Tony > >bruce
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