Author: Ed Schröder
Date: 06:36:41 08/19/00
Go up one level in this thread
On August 19, 2000 at 08:29:01, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On August 19, 2000 at 00:56:54, Ed Schröder wrote: > >>On August 18, 2000 at 23:43:07, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On August 17, 2000 at 12:12:20, Ernst A. Heinz wrote: >>> >>>>Hi Vincent, >>>> >>>>>My surprise was also big, but nevertheless i join! >>>>>Nothing wrong with joining a tournament that's >>>>>already under a lot of attack, or the tournament fades away! >>>> >>>>IMO, your story is quite different than ours because "Diep" is >>>>optimized for PCs and has always been so. Hence, you planned to >>>>attend from the beginning I suppose -- your surprise was only >>>>related to the fact that you must bring your own PC now. >>>> >>>>For us it was totally different -- we had no plans to attend >>>>_since last year_! >>>> >>>>>>The low number of participants is probably due to the fact that >>>>>>information flow regarding this tournament was almost non-existent >>>>>>until mid-July or so. >>>> >>>>I like to add something to my remark above. >>>> >>>>Now, everybody here should now that I am a strong supporter of >>>>the ICCA and do not intend to bash them or any of their volunteers' >>>>efforts to promote computer chess and related events. >>>> >>>>Nevertheless, I personally deem this year's participation fee of >>>>US-$ 100 for amateurs _prohibitively high_. This might be another >>>>reason for amateur programmers not to join the tournament. >>>> >>>>Just my humble opinion, of course ... >>>> >>>>=Ernst= >>> >>> >>>I agree. In fact, since I can't go due to classes and the expense of going >>>to England, I get to pay 200 bucks to get crafty in. I have _never_ paid an >>>entry fee in 25 years of ACM competition. I don't see the reasoning behind >>>this myself... >> >>It is not so difficult. Let me explain. The ICCA is a non-profit organization >>to promote computer chess in its widest form. The new rules are just meant to >>make it more easy for chess programmers to join the tournament. >> >>Clap, clap clap. >> >>Ed (sarcastic) > > >:) > >In my case, adding $100 to the cost of participating is just one more thing to >make me think hard about whether I want to go or not. > >I had always suggested the following about entry fees: > >1. If a non-commercial (not-for-sale-anywhere) engine participates, no entry >fee. > >2. If a commercial program is entered as an "experimental" engine, and the >programmer/company agrees to not use the results on the front of the box or in >advertisements, no entry fee. > >3. If a company enters a program, and wants to use a good result for >advertising purposes, then charge them a fee if it is needed to hold the >tournament. > >IE in this event, assuming there are 16 entries and all 16 are non-commercial >(not true of course) I can't believe that $1,600 (16 * 100 entry fee) would be >a 'make or break' condition for the event. But it is likely that it would be >a 'make or break' for one or two of the competitors. Well spoken. I don't care that commercials have to pay an entry fee but amateur programs should pay not one single dime. The world championship for many non-commercial programmers is a reason to spend months of a year in their creation in order to compete on the highest level. Some don't have the money (or opportunity) to travel and pay for an expensive hotel and only see one way out and try to find a (local) operator. For that they are punished to pay a double entry fee. The world championship is the delivery room for new talented chess programmers but somehow this escapes the ICCA and they raise new obstacles instead of making things easier. I understand that organizing events like this costs money. It would have been much better to raise the entry fee for commercial entries than asking double money from people who are not able to come in person which is a killer in itself for principal reasons as it has no single ground. Ed >I think the events like the ICC tournament are going to be the future of these >competitions. No fees. No travel.
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