Author: Vincent Diepeveen
Date: 14:59:29 08/29/00
Go up one level in this thread
On August 29, 2000 at 14:50:58, Uri Blass wrote:
>On August 29, 2000 at 13:26:36, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>
>>On August 29, 2000 at 12:21:16, Uri Blass wrote:
>>
>>>I think that the pairing in the last round was fair because
>>>zchess had weaker opponents than Sos(even after the last round I found that Sos
>>>had a better opponents score.
>>>
>>>The sum of Sos opponent score is 39.5 when the sum of zchess oppont score was
>>>only 36.
>>
>>This is all peanuts compared to playing for the world title. Note
>>that SOP is not a real fair comparision measure. It's just a method.
>>It doesn't say much significant.
>>
>>The most significant thing is how many points you have. what they did now
>>was pairing zchess against shredder and giving SOS a free point.
>>
>>If zchess would win against shredder then it would not get the
>>amateur title but the overall title as well IMHO.
>>
>>Before the 8th round you don't know anything about who you play in
>>the 9th round when your name is SOS and zchess. SOS was lucky to have
>>a few SOP more. The pairing IS ridicioulous considering that it was
>>changed the rounds before that in favour of junior for simpel reasons.
>
>I disagree.
>
>Junior played only against one weak program pqexpert when part of the programs
>above Junior played against the 2 weakest players.
>I did not find that chessbase earned from the pairing(the opposite- they
>suffered from the pairing).
Yes by the last round pairing SOS would get the world title for free,
if not then fritz would tie at least with shredder as either of the
both would get eliminated.
>If you calculate the deserved rating you will find that chessbase deserved
>better place for Junior and nimzo.
Junior deserved another few points less. At least 1 against DIEP it
got for free. Nimzo only won games on book. Are that deserved points
too?
>I did it(I assumed that the result repeat again and again and found that the
>order of programs by rating give better place for Junior and nimzo,Sos deserved
>worse place but it is only because of the fact that nimzo suffered from the
>pairing)
> >
>>Now we don't know who is better. SOS or Zchess?
>
>We could not know by one tournament who is better but the tournament suggests
>that Sos is better.
SOS sure isn't weak, but there is no doubt here: SOS had to be paired
with Zchess.
>We have information about other results.
>Zchess lost against Fritz when Sos drew with Fritz.
Same book against same book. SOS versus fritz was the same book
getting into an opposite bishop ending. Zchess was killed by the book.
He wouldn't play Bc4 again with zchess.
>Zchess drew with Junior when Sos almost won Junior(it could win Junior if it had
>the KQP vs KQ tablebases)
Another lucky game for Junior. As i said i really regret i was so asleep.
><snipped>
>>>Sos is sold as part of the young talent and by definition is a professional
>>>program.
>>
>>I'm sure that Rudolf didn't get rich by this deal.
>
>This is not the point.
>I do not support entry fee of 500$ for professional programs because I know that
>professionals are not rich.
>I only think that the organizers should follow their definitions of
>professional.
I wonder who got all that money. Let's see:
Let's say about 4000$ they got for entry fee?
That without any prize money to pay!!!
>If the definition of professional is based on money then I suggest that they
>will give another definition(for example programmer who earned at least 10000$
>from their commercial program).
Oh well, i see it this way
- there is no prize money so only costs are the rent of the room.
the room was rented anyway so this could be done low budget.
- any huge entry fee will always prevent certain programmers from entering.
Just don't give them an excuse to be away.
><snipped>
>>Oh well when chessbase can make some money i'm sure they don't care that
>>Rudolf might possibly pay more money entry fee. That's not exactly
>>chessbase style. Ask them how 'well' they cared for Frans Morsch, Alex Kure
>>and Amir Ban.
>
>I believe that if Amir Ban,Frans Morsch or Alex Kure do not like the way that
>chessbase cared for them they can stop working for chessbase.
If world would be that simple. How does frans morsch sell his program?
No normal dude in the world realizes for example that Chessica and
Fritz are the same program. Only the few freaks here at CCC might know it.
If you sign for such a thing you're tight. I'm sure it's hard to get away
then. It would take a lot of time for most to develop their own interface
anyway, or find a new interface (not many around). Some probably have
signed also for exclusivity or are tied by one or another contract.
Life is not THAT simple Uri.
>It is not a secret that Amir Ban has a full time job not in computer chess and I
>believe that there are less than 5 people in the world who can live from
>computer chess.
Oh well let's count
- 20 salesmanagers/owners from chessbase
- 10 salesmanagers/owners from millennium chess system
- 40 (?) sales managers from chessmanager (just guessed 40)
- 10 (?) programmers
I still didn't add Seifritz and other similar dudes to that.
I guess we end up in total with a 100 people or so.
That's pretty little compared to other games, not to mention if we
look to luxury things as sportcars.
>Uri
This page took 0.01 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.