Author: Thorsten Czub
Date: 14:17:22 12/14/97
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>You have to admit, almost all the worlds problems are caused by our >negative emotions, and our irrational sides. Sorry, I have to defend my point of view. I am thinking the OPPOSITE!! Your point of view is Spock's. And my point of view is a mixture of Kirk/Bones. I think feelings and emotions are not the source of the evil. They are the only way to control life. Did you read the book from Damasio ? He has found out the logic and ratio is not working WITHOUT feelings or access to emotional brain-parts. This explains why MANY people who claim they are logical and cool rational behave like mad men. Because they have NO access anymore to their emotions. I think the same problem is with computers. They are little vulcans. They can only play stronger chess if they learn how to dream ! How to be enthusiastic. I think this is what Marty tries with Mchess7 (to make this thread ON topic.). If you look how high CSTal and Mchess and also Hiarcs evaluate about positional stuff, also Shredder2 (and Crafty!!), you see that they try to make their machines FEEL (=make Data feel !!) >I agree with you here completely. An unemotional female would be not >be very interesting. But I don't think I've every known one! I know some. >Yes, I admit to being emotional. So you are in a problem like SPOCK. Society says: be cool and rational, but he is a mixture, 2 souls in his body ! One surpressed emotional part and one dominant rational part. > But when I am in "scientist mode" I >like to think rationally and steer around the B.S. !!! Understand. Scientist mode !! Good definition. > This is more >productive. Really ? With chris it is the complete opposite. He CANNOT be succesfully productive in a scientist emulation. That blocks his strengths. Funny. > But I still occasionally go crazy and experiment with >highly speculative and imaginative stuff. Brilliant. > I would go insane if all I >did was >the boring engineering part. But the boring, careful engineering stuff >is what works I'm afraid! Really ?! Than CSTal is a dead-end street. What a pity. Chris is in holiday. I am still not having Mchess7 and no nimzo98. (although I ordered them a week before. ChessNiggemann is really SLOW.) This is a very sad christmas. No new program so far on my machines. > >But the wonderful thing about being human is that we can do both! > In us is all 3: Spock trying to control his "weak" emotional parts Kirk using his human parts to win against all kinds of problems. Bones, always thinking about the ethical aspects of something. Fighting against the cool rational but inhuman "point of view". > >>> We do have great pattern recognition facilities which >>>you have alluded to, but our judgement is pretty poor. > >>Hm. Really ? > >Yes, we excel at recognizing patterns. When our judgement is >strong, it's because the patterns are there and working well >for us. > Ok - my request was more a joke. I KNOW about the pattern recognition. This was ONE of my points. >And we are also capable of good logic (although I rarely see this) I gave up to USE logic. Since I read about Goedel and Einstein-Podolsky-Rosen and Bell's theorem and 3-times light-speed experiments today, I think aristotelic logic is a dead-end-street. The eastern Ying-Yang concept (boolean group-logic) is more interesting and will NOT lead to contradictions. Our computers follow still the aristotelic logic, despite some fuzzy-logic approaches. What a pity. This way HAL will never solve the main-problems of playing chess-. >Sometimes we combine this well with other stuff like intuition >and can come up with some great things. But what REALLY holds us >back is the tremendous amount of crap floating around in our brains, >the stuff I mentioned earlier, irrational thought, strong unobjective >biases and negative emotions. I don't think so. Irrationality does NOT come from emotions. It is a product of having no acces to the emotions anymore but trying to be still logically. This won't work. You cannot play 17+4 or poker without access to emotion. Pure rational points of view cannot work. I was pleased to recognize that LASKER thought the same. He found out that light-speed has no limit and told Einstein about. Einstein had to to think the opposite of course, it was on his axioms. But Einstein was wrong. Infinite speed is possible. Also negative speed. LASKER was right. Very funny. The chess player beats the physician, and why ? because the chess-player lasker knew from playing chess that EMOTIONS are ONE MAIN important thing to value the world. Aristotelic logic (a+b)*c is wrong. It will lead to contradictions. Why do we still try to force our mind to think it categories like: False, right, cannot-say or 1-0 , 0-1 , 1/2. These 3 categories (coming from using aristotelic-logic) are wrong ! They don't work. Not in life. Not in chess. Not in physics. > >-- Don
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