Author: Mark Young
Date: 05:11:19 09/26/00
Go up one level in this thread
On September 26, 2000 at 05:31:47, Uri Blass wrote: >On September 26, 2000 at 05:00:19, Mark Young wrote: > >>On September 25, 2000 at 22:28:03, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On September 25, 2000 at 15:40:20, Mark Young wrote: >>> >>>>On September 25, 2000 at 13:48:30, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>> >>>>>On September 25, 2000 at 13:21:34, Mark Young wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On September 25, 2000 at 09:01:19, Antonio Dieguez wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>hello! >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I come to ask two things, please... >>>>>>> >>>>>>>What are the results of the basics endgames KRB vs KR and KRN vs KR, both draws? >>>>>>> if it is, there is some exceptions except the obvius? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>And can someone post some of these mate in n positions with n very very very >>>>>>>high? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Thanks! >>>>>> >>>>>>Easy position to win!! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>This is wrong. _most_ KRB vs KR and KRN vs KR are _drawn_. There are some >>>>>wins for the stronger side, and even a couple of wins for the side without >>>>>the B/N, but in general these are dead draws. >>>> >>>>You must not have had your coffee yet today, but the above is known as sarcasm. >>>> >>>>Thank you for the info on KRB vs KR endings I did not know that. >>> >>> >>>Sorry... I apparently missed the sarcasm. :) >>> >>>It is amazing that an extra piece can't force a win. And it is more amazing >>>that because of this, many programs will evaluate a KRB vs KRPP as winning for >>>the KRB, when in reality, the RPP wins or it is a draw, the RB has _no_ winning >>>chances. >> >>:) I thought you would have understood, the point being that even though the >>position is a win for the stronger side in this case, what human could win this, >>as one minor slip brings the position back to a draw again. The win is so >>complex if you look at the mating line, a player would have to calculate all the >>move to mate, as positional judgement just fails in positions like this. > >The distance to conversion is clearly smaller than 100 plies so some small >mistakes are not going to prevent white to do the mate. > >It is clearly that white have to calculate but positional judgement can also >help(if you learned winning positions before it can help because you know target >positions to go for). > >It is possible that GM's who learned KRB vs KR can mate at tournament time >control against programs with tablebases from this position and I do not know. > >Uri You are mistaken, KRB Vs KB is to complex for any positional judgement. Take a look at the below position. Tell me if this almost identical position is a win or a draw without tablebase, you can only use human calculation or positional judgement. If the below position is a draw, tell us what positional factors you used to come to that conclusion. [d]5k2/1R6/8/5K2/3B4/8/8/4r3 w - - 0 1
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