Author: Uri Blass
Date: 07:48:21 10/13/00
Go up one level in this thread
On October 13, 2000 at 08:00:45, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >On October 13, 2000 at 05:37:48, Georg v. Zimmermann wrote: > >>On October 12, 2000 at 19:32:22, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: >> >>>On October 11, 2000 at 22:15:23, Daniel Chancey wrote: >>> >>>>NM DragonSlayr from chess.net claims that white has a forced win in the >>>>beginning of a wild 5 game. Wild 5 is the original setup of pieces, but the >>>>pawns are 1 square away from queening and the pieces are in front of the pawns! >>>> >>>>I'm not sure if Computers can be accurate to disprove DragonSlayr's claim. Is >>>>Wild 5 a win for white? >>>> >>>>Castle2000 >>> >>>the openingsadvantage is real huge. if i let diep search parallel >>>about an hour at the position then the score rises and rises and rises >>>from +1.x initially to +5.x after an hour. i can't imagine this game >>>is NOT won for white easily. You can directly get a huge openings >>>advantage. obviously 2 queens against 1 queen is a simple win and >>>exactly that is what you can achieve there. Now the problem is that >>>the branching factor gets quite huge after a few moves as queen moves >>>are there plenty, so you can't give 'scientific' proof that you win >>>easily. But a queen versus a rook already in evaluation up after a >>>few ply of search in the start position? >>> >>>that's clearly a game which is won by white yeah. >> >>Hello Vincent, >> >>I talked with some wild5 expert a while ago about why computers can't play it >>very well. It is very similar to the problems we face in crazyhouse (you know >>the game where you can place pieces you captured from opponent - bit like >>Shogi). One thing is the obvious high branching factor, another big thing is >>that games are much more decided by mating attacks, and sacks of whole pieces >>for a tempo or two are common. Now bots completely freak out when you have >>poseval() function which can reach +-500 pawn units (at least thats what happens >>to me) so they do not see that some of the good wild5 opening lines for black >>include a knight sack very early when it is not forced already. >> >>Wild5 might well be a win for white theoretically like normal chess might be a >>draw. But prove it ?! Bah. > >i think on fics diep is regurarly logged in (after the weekend again >changing from room now) if fics allows this type of game, try it against >DIEP dual. DIEP knows a few things about passed pawns and king safety >and checks in qsearch which makes it extremely hard to beat in this >kind of games. Nevertheless the openingsadvantage is so huge directly >that anyone who plays it for the first time is mated in 3 moves from the >start. I disagree. I am sure that every player who is not weak in tactic and seriously think about the game can avoid losing in 3 moves. The idea of mate in 3 is simple to see. The fact that there is a simple trap in the opening is not a proof of your theory that the advantage of white is huge. Uri
This page took 0 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.