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Subject: Re: Opinions and campaigns...

Author: Chris Whittington

Date: 11:56:22 01/01/98

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On January 01, 1998 at 13:10:25, Ed Schröder wrote:

>>Posted by Chris Whittington on January 01, 1998 at 11:06:20:
>
>>First you try censorship .....
>
>>Then resort to rudeness ......
>
>>>Blah blah blah...
>
>You the master of irony can't have this?
>
>
>>Incidentally snipping away an entire alternative explanation for the
>>Mchess SSDF results.
>
>Perhaps Mchess is a strong program?

Of course it is. That's what the argument is about. The standard view is
that it cooks its strength. I don't take the standard view. But strength
wasn't the snipped stuff, presumably you didn't read it.

>
>
>>>You and I (although commercial) in our hearts still are the same as many
>>>other chess programmers reading this message board. We have a passion
>>>for computer chess. That's one of the reasons why our programs are good
>>>and we still continue. We discuss topics here with heart and soul.
>
>>Fine, but not very meaningful, unless ......
>
>Not very meaningful?????????????
>
>It's the HEART of this whole attack of yours!

Your opinions you call facts, and mine attacks.

>
>OTHERS can FREELY speak about any chess program and can say what they
>want. If I say something about "another" program should that be
>different
>because I happen to sell the program I have written?

Yes and no. I think we need to be careful for this reason (amongst
others).

>
>This is the WHOLE discussion in a nutshell.

Then we live in parallel universes.

>
>You say that because Jeroen quoted Sandro Necchi 2-3 times here this
>is an attack on Mchess. Perhaps Jeroen said it (and repeated it) to
>prove his point in a discussion?
>
>Ever heard of an opinion?
>
>Perhaps there was no "campaign" at all?

This is entirely possible. So sticking to this point instead of muddying
counter-attacks would have closed it earlier. If you say it is no
campaign. fair enough. But you didn't till now, just counterattacked
instead.

>
>Ever considered that possibility?

Of course .....

>
>And if you are wrong you are dead wrong, no?

No. There's a prima facie case for there being a campaign. patterns and
repetitions. Doesn't prove it, but indicates the possibility.

So you telling me there's no campaign ? Ok, fine, Marty Hirsch saya
Mchess is not targeted on specific opponents. I believe this and I'll
believe you. You say its just opinion expression, ok.

But one thing: don't claim that if program xyz creates a fixed book line
that causes program abc to fall over, that when abc counters this line
with variations in book to give rise to a line that abc wins; that
*each* program team is doing different things, xyz bad, and abc good.

>
>So the key is what you are willing to believe. Apparently you have
>no high opinion of Jeroen.

Not so. You're adding to the broth some mud. Jeroen is ok by me. Arguing
with his opinions doesn't imply dislike.

>
>Well, I have talked to Jeroen. He will never do it again. He with
>great care will talk about "other" programs because apparently it's
>risky to speak open-minded about computer topics because you easily
>can be associated with "commercial"....

Who's playing victim now, then ?

>
>Satisfied?

If we don't have to go through the same rigmarole next year, yes.

>
>And for your false accusations and the big topic you made out of it
>this still is a moderator case.

Well you know more than me there. I'm not in your agreement-clique.

Do your worst, Ed. I'm off on my holiday .......

Chris Whittington






>
>- Ed -
>
>
>
>>>It's dirty of you to make advantage of that by implying Jeroen's
>>>opinion is a "campaign" to hurt a commercial opponent and sit on
>>>that statement and make it a big topic.
>
>>... you try and set up the famous 'mud on Rebel' defence. Sorry, Ed,
>>but if you try this every time anybody ever makes a critic, it begins to
>>wear a bit thin.
>
>>Its maybe a big topic because you never responded to any detail, instead
>>you responded each time with counter attacks, hitting the messenger,
>>going for censorship, being rude with blah-blah-blah and so on.
>
>>Chris Whittington



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