Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 19:59:44 01/09/98
Go up one level in this thread
On January 09, 1998 at 21:03:51, Howard Exner wrote: >On January 09, 1998 at 17:45:31, Bruce Moreland wrote: > >> >>On January 09, 1998 at 14:26:44, Howard Exner wrote: >> >>>r3rk2/ppq2pbQ/2p1b1p1/4p1B1/2P3P1/3P1B2/P3PPK1/1R5R w - - id"Seiriwan - >>>Sokolov,A"; bm Qxg7+; >>> >>>Is this an example of a singular extension mate theme? >>>Will this be difficult to solve as a Queen and rook are >>>sacrificed followed by the "quiet" Bf6? >> >>I don't know whether these mates are efficiently found with singular >>extension, that was just a nasty rumor that I started. >> >>I don't know if singular extension is good for anything. The paper that >>I read originally about it claimed a pretty big benefit from this, but a >>subsequent paper claimed much more modest benefit, and there were >>caveats that the reason it might work for DT could have something to do >>with DT's search, which was pretty sloppy near the tips. >> >>Absolutely no offense to DT or DB or DT or Hsu or Campbell, but, I think >>the two statements taken with the largest number of grains of salt by >>this community in the last ten years are: >> >>1) Botvinnik had a working chess program. >>2) Singular extension is mythical and magic. >> >>I don't know of anyone who will make a statement of the form: "I/We do >>singular extension, it helped us a lot, we proved to ourselves that it >>is a good thing, and for you guys who are curious, here is a position >>that we think it helps a lot in, and here is some other cool info >>involving lots of other interesting numbers, for instance, look how many >>more we get in the ECM suite with this!" >> >>If someone wants to make all or part of the above statement, I would be >>delighted to hear it. >> >>This problem is very hard for my program. I do not know why. I suspect >>it is hard because white goes down a tremendous amount of material and >>doesn't get it back immediately. This is similar to Wac 141 (for me), >>although harder. Mine is apparently vulnerable to this sort of thing. >> >>I bet other programs get it quickly. > >I am always interested in the problems that program X finds quickly >while program Y struggles. It makes me curious as to what makes them >tick. Rebel 8 for example finds WAC 141 rather quickly but has a very >hard time finding this above mate in 7. I think it is the quiet move, >Bf6 that is the stumbling block for Rebel. > >I'm not a programmer but follow with interest this recent Singular >extension thread. It sounds like a similar technique humans employ >of giving themselves two moves in a row to help determine tactical >candidate moves. what you described is exactly how null-move search works...
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