Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 17:23:45 11/28/00
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On November 28, 2000 at 16:55:46, Ed Schröder wrote: >On November 28, 2000 at 13:38:42, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 28, 2000 at 13:19:11, Ed Schröder wrote: >> >>>On November 28, 2000 at 13:00:02, Dann Corbit wrote: >>> >>>>A number of authors have stated in this forum that they use the WAC and other >>>>test suites to tune their programs. This may or may not make them play better, >>>>as you know. Consider that the Rebel settings for solving positions and the >>>>Rebel settings for playing the strongest chess are different. >>>> >>>>Therefore, to tune purely to solve test suites is probably not the best way to >>>>create a strong playing program (though it does produce decent chess). >>> >>>Using wellknown test positions to test if your program changes do >>>a better job is something else than Bob said: >>> >>>quote: >>> >>> I have seen (a) programs tuned to choose the right move to improve >>> their test result scores artificially; >>> >>>end quote >>> >>>Note the word artificially which implies cheating. >>> >>>This of course may be the case but then I would like to see it >>>supported by examples. >>> >>>Ed >> >> >>Wasn't it the SSDF that found _one_ case of this? Or was it the CSS readers? >>I don't remember specifically. But the test was to set up the same position, >>with colors reversed, and the program then failed miserably to find the right >>move, yet it did it almost instantly with the original position. > >It was CSS about Rebel 6.0 and they found the precursor of the EOC >approach. But it was presented as cheating. It has been discussed >a dozen times by now so you should know better in the between time. > I didn't say "cheating" did I? I believe I said "a program was tweaked to choose the right moves in a test suite for the wrong reason." Whether it was accidental or on purpose, that statement is _still_ true. So there is one example. There are others. > >>Others have tweaked to do better on the Kopec/Bratko test positions. One >>company used to advertise their results on the outside of the box the thing >>was sold in. > >You accuse without giving examples. You should be moderated :) > >Ed I did _not_ accuse. IE please give me the name of the person I am supposed to be accusing of doing something. I made a simple, direct, accurate, incontrovertible statement about programs being tuned against specific test suites. The best example suite was the Kopec/Bratko positions. But there have been others.
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