Author: Terry Ripple
Date: 13:53:40 12/05/00
Go up one level in this thread
On December 05, 2000 at 08:16:22, Uri Blass wrote: >On December 05, 2000 at 08:00:16, Laurence Chen wrote: > >>On December 05, 2000 at 04:29:46, Terry Ripple wrote: >> >>>On December 05, 2000 at 00:40:00, Uri Blass wrote: >>> >>>>On December 04, 2000 at 22:10:36, Laurence Chen wrote: >>>> >>>>>On December 04, 2000 at 17:48:10, Uri Blass wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>These positions are from games of shredder5 that Chris Taylor posted. >>>>>> >>>>>>[D]2rqrb2/3n1ppk/b2p3p/1ppPpN2/p3P1P1/P1P2QR1/1PB2PP1/R1B3K1 b - - 0 1 >>>>>> >>>>>>In this position Shredder5 played f6 and evaluated the position as 0.00 >>>>>> >>>>>>It is not the only case of 0.00 evaluations of lost positions of shredder. >>>>>> >>>>>>[D]2r2bk1/B6p/1p4p1/3Pp1q1/Q1n1P3/8/P3N1PP/R5K1 w - - 0 1 >>>>>> >>>>>>Here Shredder5 also played Qd7 and evaluated the position as 0.00 >>>>>>23.Qd7 0.00/11 Bc5+ 24.Kh1 0.00/12 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>[D]2rrn1k1/pp1b1pp1/1n1q4/3p1PPN/3P3R/1PNB4/P1Q2K2/6R1 b - - 0 1 >>>>>> >>>>>>Here shredder5 evaluated the position as 0.06 pawn against itself and played >>>>>>27...Qc6. >>>>>> >>>>>>The point of this post is not to attack Shredder that did very good result and >>>>>>won the matches against the tigers but only to show that all programs and not >>>>>>only Fritz have positions in the middle game that they are wrong when they >>>>>>evaluate the positions as a draw. >>>>>> >>>>>>Uri >>>>>Uri just because a chess engine gives an evaluation of 0.00 does not necessary >>>>>mean that it is a drawn position. >>>> >>>>I know. >>>>The point is that Thorsten attacked Fritz because Fritz showed 0.00 in middle >>>>game positions that were certainly not a draw. >>>>My examples were to demonstrate thorsten that this behaviour is also of programs >>>>like Shredder5 and not only of Fritz and there is no justification to call fritz >>>>stupid only because of the fact that there are positions that it does not >>>>understand like every program. >>>> >>>>Uri >>>-------------- >>>An analysis of 0.00 in the middle game just means that both sides have equal >>>chances to win from that position at that very moment! >>> >>>Terry >>I agree with you Terry. > >Did you look at the positions? >Do you think that the sides have equal chances? ----------------------------------------- A program can make mistakes about an evaluation just as many strong human players make evaluation mistakes about a position and many Grandmasters don't agree about what is the better move at critical points of a game! The game of chess is too complex for anyone, including programs to make every evaluation correct at any given point. Regards,Terry ------------------------------ > >The point of Thorsten Czub in his posts some weeks ago was that Fritz's problem >was always that it evaluated 0.00 when it is easy to see that both sides do not >have equal chances and I remember that he talked about a possible future >situation when future fritz shows 0.00 whenfuture shresser understands what is >going on. > >I think that wrong 0.00 happens to every program. > >Uri
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