Author: Uri Blass
Date: 12:46:56 12/13/00
Go up one level in this thread
On December 13, 2000 at 15:43:52, Uri Blass wrote: >On December 13, 2000 at 12:17:20, Ed Schröder wrote: > >>On December 13, 2000 at 11:31:01, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On December 13, 2000 at 06:16:54, Uri Blass wrote: >>> >>>>On December 13, 2000 at 05:41:34, Günther Simon wrote: >>>> >>>>>On December 13, 2000 at 02:17:16, Uri Blass wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On December 13, 2000 at 01:33:25, Jouni Uski wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>Oh not again!! This trojanishe Esel (g5 sacrifice). >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Jouni >>>>>> >>>>>>I think that avoiding hxg5 is a good test position for chess programs. >>>>>> >>>>>>I am surprised that shredder falled into this trap in tournament time control >>>>>>because I know that one of the things that was improved in shredder5 relatively >>>>>>to shredder4 is tactics. >>>>>> >>>>>>I believe that other chess programs may do better. >>>>>> >>>>>>Junior6 probably can avoid hxg5 on the same hardware at tournament time >>>>>>control(I say probably because I have not Junior6 and I only checked that >>>>>>Junior5.9 can see 0.00 evaluation for hxg5 at depth 17 and later changes its >>>>>>mind to dxc4) >>>>>> >>>>>>Uri >>>>> >>>>>As far as I know some progs now have implemented an Anti-Trojan function. >>>>>One of them must be Crafty. I am just wondering why it is not implemented >>>>>in all newer chess software?! >>>>> >>>>>Günther >>>> >>>>I know that the anti trojan function is not used by crafty against copmputers. >>>> >>>>The antitrojan function can cause problems if the program will be afraid to take >>>>g5 when it is good to do it so I dislike it. >>>> >>>>I prefer to see anti-trojan extensions when the computer discovers trojan >>>>situation(positions when hxg5 hxg5 is possible at the root) >>>> >>>>It means that if hxg5 hxg5 is possible(I assume the side who sacrifice is white >>>>without loss of generalization) then the program will consider the typical >>>>trojan attack moves as 0 plies in the search. >>>> >>>>Usually taking the piece at g5 is the tactical mistake so doing the extensions >>>>only when hxg5 hxg5 is possible at the root can solve the practical problem >>>>without doing the program slower in most of the cases. >>>> >>>>Uri >>> >>> >>>The trojan horse detection is now automatic in crafty. If it sees the key >>>elements of the trap, at the root position, then it will enable the anti- >>>trojan code and in the game given, it will _never_ consider hxg. If one or >>>more key elements are missing, then it will rip it given the chance, because >>>it will be safe. >> >>As you see Uri "sometimes" pre-processing can be very useful. >> >>Ed > >I admit that preprocessing is an easy way to solve some problems in the >evaluation but I prefer to see improving the evaluation and the extensions >because Crafty may avoid hxg5 also in cases when hxg5 is winning and for >analysis I prefer to see at least an option without preprocessing. Another possibility is that for analysis it will be possible to use preprocessing from the same point of view when I can choose the point of view that is the root position. I think that it may be better because it gives more options for the customer. Uri
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