Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 21:18:59 03/07/01
Go up one level in this thread
On March 07, 2001 at 14:05:20, Andreas Schwartmann wrote: >On March 06, 2001 at 18:37:15, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>Run an event any way you want. That is what this seems to be about. But I >>don't see anything wrong with Thorsten's approach of letting people fix bugs >>as they are detected. Will it _really_ corrupt the final results? Did >>introducing changes after each round of the WMCCC event prevent shredder >>from winning? Did shredder get changed? Does it matter? > > >Sure it does: Who really won? Shredder 5? Shredder 5.01? Maybe even Shredder >5.2? The only thing you actually CAN say is SMK has won the tourney with his >engine(s). And I guess you can say that it's not that the strongest engine won, >but the best-modified-between-rounds-engine did win. Maybe Shredder only won >because SMK put in some hours in modifying the engine between rounds in order to Quick time-warp back to 1973. Fischer is saying "it isn't clear who is the best player with today's system, it is more a statement of who has the best group of "seconds" that are up all night analyzing adjourned games, preparing opening TNs for the next game, etc..." Don't humans do _exactly_ the same thing? The concept of a "constant" chess player is simply not reality. In the 1986 WCCC, the CB that played rounds 1 and 2 was different by 4 lines of code from the CB that played the last 3 rounds. I have no doubt but that had we used the same program for all 5 rounds we would have been lucky to break even at 2.5-2.5. By fixing a bug I introduced, we finished 4-1 and won the tournament. Were we the best there? Based on my chess skill and knowledge, yes we were. Would we have won without the bug fix? Not a real chance in hell. Did that taint the result? Not IMHO... >make adaptions regarding the next opponents. Maybe Gandalf did not win, because >Steen was not present at the tourney and could not make modifications. Maybe >Gandalf was Gandalf 4.32h all the time, while Shredder came in many >incarnations, each one fine tuned to a particular opponent. So these Shredders >won. Does this say anything about Shredder's real strength? Nope. Which Shredder >version anyway? > >Andreas If you don't go, you _definitely_ give up a bit. No doubt about it. I am usually unable to attend WMCCC events... they are too long for me to miss a week of classes. The trips are too expensive when family vacation time is considered a precious commodity. And I never have any real hope of winning such an event not being there. If I watch, I learn something _every_ round, and can often spot problems that don't lose in the current round, but which might lose in future rounds if the right circumstance arises. I try to fix them a.s.a.p. of course. If I am not there, that 'feedback loop' doesn't happpen.
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