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Subject: Re: Gandalf and endgames.

Author: Dieter Buerssner

Date: 12:53:35 03/18/01

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On March 18, 2001 at 04:12:41, Uri Blass wrote:

>>>>> 8/8/pq1PQ1kp/6p1/8/7P/5PK1/8 b - -

>Crafty18.03 under chessbase(64 mbytes hash) cannot reproduce it.

I tried yet again, and I can reproduce the lines I had posted.

>The score of it is 7.47 at depth 12 but 7.79 at depth 13 when the main line is
>1...Kg7 2.Qd7+ at depth>=13
>The difference between depthes 11 and 12 is 0.4 pawns and not 0.39 pawns.
>
>At depth 14 the score is +8.02 and it finished depth 14 in a few minutes on
>pIII800 that is clearly less than your 20 minutes.

I tested with 12M hash and 5M hashp. Perhaps because of the bigger transposition
tables you used, you got even higer speedup, than the hardware difference would
suggest. When I retried with slightly bigger hash, I have seen the next output
after 13:46.

Ok, once again, this time with 24M hash, 5M hashp, TBs disabled (to make it
easier reproducable):

Crafty v18.6
[...]
Black(1): st 100000
search time set to 100000.00.
Black(1): go
end-game phase
              time surplus   0.00  time limit 1666:40 (1666:40)
         nss  depth   time  score   variation (1)
[...]
                7->   0.95   8.30   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb3 4.
                                    d7 g4 5. Qd6+ Kg7 6. d8=Q Qxh3+
                8     1.45   8.05   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. d8=Q Qxf2+ 7.
                                    Kh1 Kf5 <HT>
                8->   1.48   8.05   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. d8=Q Qxf2+ 7.
                                    Kh1 Kf5 <HT>
                9     2.23     ++   1. ... Kg7!!
                9->   3.90   7.66   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. d8=Q Qxf2+ 7.
                                    Kh1 Kf5 8. Qf8+ <HT>
               10     5.78     ++   1. ... Kg7!!
               10->  10.99   7.27   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. d8=Q Qxf2+ 7.
                                    Kh1 Kf5 8. Qf8+ <HT>
               11    14.45   7.61   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. Kg1 g4 7. d8=Q
                                    Qxd8 8. Qxd8 gxh3
               11->  14.68   7.61   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. Kg1 g4 7. d8=Q
                                    Qxd8 8. Qxd8 gxh3
               12    45.33     ++   1. ... Kg7!!
               12->   1:15   7.22   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. Kg1 g4 7. d8=Q
                                    Qxd8 8. Qxd8 gxh3
               13     2:35     ++   1. ... Kg7!!
               13->   3:56   6.83   1. ... Kg7 2. Qe7+ Kg6 3. Qc7 Qb1 4.
                                    d7 Qe4+ 5. Kh2 Qd4 6. Kg1 g4 7. d8=Q
                                    Qxd8 8. Qxd8 gxh3
               14    13:46     --   1. ... Kg7
               14    19:18   7.90   1. ... Kg7 2. Qd7+ Kg6 3. h4 g4 4.
                                    Qxg4+ Kf6 5. Qf4+ Ke6 6. Qxh6+ Kd5
                                    7. Qh5+ Kxd6 8. Qh6+ Kc5 9. Qxb6+ Kxb6
                                    10. h5 a5 11. h6 a4
               14->  19:20   7.90   1. ... Kg7 2. Qd7+ Kg6 3. h4 g4 4.
                                    Qxg4+ Kf6 5. Qf4+ Ke6 6. Qxh6+ Kd5
                                    7. Qh5+ Kxd6 8. Qh6+ Kc5 9. Qxb6+ Kxb6
                                    10. h5 a5 11. h6 a4
Black(0): ?
              time=22:39  cpu=99%  mat=0  n=241885205  fh=88%  nps=177905
              ext-> chk=29059370 pp=1117756 1rep=1452948 mate=44333
              predicted=0  nodes=241885205  evals=16868856
              endgame tablebase-> probes done=0  successful=0
              hashing-> trans/ref=42%  pawn=8%  used=99%


Can anybody can reproduce this? Otherwise, it would mean, that I have set up
something totally wrong, which certainly would interest me.

>I can add that Qe7+ is also an easy win for white when the best line includes a
>repetition
>1.Qe7+ Kg6 2.Qe6+ Kg7 3.Qd7+

Sure. But I think, it is quite unlikely, that a chess engine will show a main
line starting like this.

Regards,
Dieter




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