Author: Sune Larsson
Date: 08:06:37 03/21/01
Go up one level in this thread
On March 21, 2001 at 09:15:26, Eduard Nemeth wrote:
>On March 21, 2001 at 04:11:44, Sune Larsson wrote:
>
>>On March 20, 2001 at 23:10:50, Eduard Nemeth wrote:
>>
>>>I played a game vs. Deep Fritz from this Position:
>>>
>>>rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/1NBQKBNR w Kkq -
>>>
>>>(DF with 64 MB hash on a P600):
>>>
>>>[Event "10'"]
>>>[Site "?"]
>>>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>>>[Round "1"]
>>>[White "Nemeth,E"]
>>>[Black "Deep Fritz"]
>>>[Result "1/2-1/2"]
>>>[FEN "rnbqkbnr/pppppppp/8/8/8/8/PPPPPPPP/1NBQKBNR w Kkq -"]
>>>
>>>1. Na3 {0} e5 {-5.09/12 17} 2. g3 {2} Nc6 {-5.38/11 13}
>>>3. Nb1 {6} Nf6 {-5.41/11 12} 4. d3 {5} d5 {-5.31/12 26}
>>>5. h4 {7} Bc5 {-5.66/11 28} 6. Bg2 {4} O-O {-5.63/10 19}
>>>7. Bg5 {21} h6 {-5.81/11 21} 8. e3 {2} hxg5 {-7.19/10 6}
>>>9. hxg5 {1} Ng4 {-7.34/10 12} 10. f4 {2} Nxe3 {-9.84/8 5}
>>>11. Qh5 {3} Nxg2+ {-9.28/7 6} 12. Kf1 {12} Ne3+ {-7.00/8
>>>10} 13. Ke1 {13} Nxc2+ {-5.59/10 0} 14. Kd2 {19} Be3+
>>>{0.00/12 0} 15. Kxc2 {9} Nd4+ {0.00/12 10} 16. Kc3 {18}
>>>Nb5+ {0.00/12 5} 17. Kc2 {14} f6 {0.00/13 0} 18. g6 {26}
>>>Nd4+ {0.00/14 0} 19. Kc3 {55} Nb5+ {0.00/15 2} 20. Kc2 {3}
>>>Nd4+ {0.00/14 18} 21. Kc3 {3} Nb5+ {0.00/13 5} 22. Kc2 {2}
>>>1/2-1/2
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Eduard
>>
>> Yes, Fritz has a terrible weakness when white plays h4, then puts
>> a piece on g5 - Fritz will often play ...h6 and take the piece,
>> therebye opening the h-file. You have shown this in numerous games.
>> This is tragicomical. Do you have any idea about how other top programs
>> handle this this type of positions - Junior, Shredder, Rebel,
>> Gambit Tiger, CM? Guess King Safety is the name of the game..
>>
>> Sune
>
>Hello!
>
>I whould this tested....and it was draw! :))
>
>I played many games vs. Fritz, and I know where Fritz is bad.
>
>In my tests is Tiger the best program against human, Century too
>
>Against Fritz, Shredder und Junior I have a better chance!
>
>Here games was i played against Junior6a, Shredder 5 and Gambit Tiger 1.0.
>(and Fritz).
>
>"first 5 moves" give Harald Faber im Gambitsoft forum than book-moves.
>I this win! From this first moves i make a book in all programs and played
>it also.
Thanks Eduard! These are very revealing games. Fritz is known to have
unsufficient King Safety, and should have been punished for it a long
time ago. Maybe Shredder and Junior play in the same league, when it comes
down to KS. This is one of the drawbacks with all the comp-comp testing,
matches and tournaments. These weaknesses are simply not revealed.
But they are clearly displayed in human-comp games. That's why we
appreciate Rebel's games vs strong humans at tournament level, Hyatt's
focus on making Crafty play strong vs humans and the whole concept of
Gambit Tiger. I also think that CS Tal deserves recognition.
No surprise that you had far more problems with Tiger and
GT. And a new and stronger version of these programs are just around
the corner...;)
Sune
>
>
>[Event "30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Nemeth,Eduard"]
>[Black "Junior 6a"]
>[ECO "C24"]
>[Result "1-0"]
>
>1. e4 {0} e5 {0} 2. Bc4 {6} Nf6 {0} 3. d4 {2} exd4 {0}
>4. Nf3 {3} Nxe4 {0} 5. Qxd4 {2} Nf6 {0} 6. O-O {8} d5
>{-0.27/13 61} 7. Bb5+ {9} c6 {-0.56/14 41} 8. Bd3 {5} Be7
>{-0.67/16 73} 9. Bg5 {24} O-O {-0.79/15 85} 10. Qh4 {21} h6
>{-1.18/14 54} 11. Nc3 {2} hxg5 {-2.65/15 27} 12. Nxg5 {5}
>g6 {-2.62/15 13} 13. Qh6 {21} Qe8 {-2.58/15 43} 14. Rfe1
>{2} a5 {-1.20/14 71} 15. Nce4 {2} dxe4 {13.56/16 102}
>16. Rxe4 {6} Bg4 {#10/16 86} 17. Rxg4 {10} Bc5 {#9/15 38}
>18. Rh4 {4} Bxf2+ {#8/17 29} 19. Kxf2 {9} Ng4+ {#7/18 41}
>20. Rxg4 {5} Qe3+ {#6/20 34} 21. Kxe3 {4} Re8+ {#5/20 25}
>22. Re4 {6} Rxe4+ {#4/37 21} 23. Bxe4 {14} Nd7 {#3/61 0}
>24. Qh7+ {9} Kf8 {#3/3 0} 25. Qxf7# {1} 1-0
>
>
>
>[Event "Blitz30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "5"]
>[White "Nemeth,E"]
>[Black "Shredder 5"]
>[ECO "C24"]
>[Result "1-0"]
>
>1. e4 {0s} e5 {Buch 0s} 2. Bc4 {2s} Nf6 {Buch 0s} 3. d4
>{2s} exd4 {Buch 0s} 4. Nf3 {1s} Nxe4 {Buch 0s} 5. Qxd4 {2s}
>Nf6 {Buch 0s} 6. O-O {1s} d5 {+0.09/10 31s} 7. Bb5+ {2s} c6
>{+0.84/11 38s} 8. Bd3 {4s} Be7 {+0.88/11 20s} 9. Bg5 {3s}
>O-O {+1.07/11 27s} 10. Qh4 {2s (Sc3)} h6 {+1.71/9 5s}
>11. Nc3 {4s (Lf4)} hxg5 {+2.35/11 1:19m} 12. Nxg5 {2s} g6
>{+2.37/11 1:14m} 13. Qh6 {1s} Qe8 {+2.64/10 33s} 14. Rfe1
>{1s (Tae1)} Na6 {+0.64/10 2:25m} 15. Nce4 {1s (Te3)} dxe4
>{-M10/14 4:10m} 16. Rxe4 {6s} Bc5 {-M8/11 52s} 17. Rh4 {7s}
>Bxf2+ {-M7/12 41s} 18. Kxf2 {1s} Qe3+ {-M6/11 25s} 19. Kxe3
>{1s} Ng4+ {-M5/12 23s} 20. Rxg4 {1s} Re8+ {-M4/12 42s}
>21. Be4 {26s} Rxe4+ {-M3/13 42s} 22. Rxe4 {0s} Be6 {-M2/8
>23s} 23. Rh4 {1s} Rd8 {-M1/8 8s} 24. Qh8# {1s} 1-0
>
>
>
>[Event "30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Nemeth,E"]
>[Black "Fritz 6a"]
>[ECO "C24"]
>[Result "1-0"]
>
>1. e4 {0} e5 {0} 2. Bc4 {2} Nf6 {0} 3. d4 {2} exd4 {0}
>4. Nf3 {2} Nxe4 {0} 5. Qxd4 {1} Nf6 {0} 6. O-O {5} d5
>{-0.53/11 38} 7. Bb5+ {4} c6 {-0.72/13 91} 8. Bd3 {3} Be7
>{-0.75/13 74} 9. Bg5 {3} O-O {-0.81/12 91} 10. Qh4 {2} h6
>{-1.34/12 45} 11. Nc3 {2} hxg5 {-2.34/12 16} 12. Nxg5 {2}
>g6 {-1.91/13 69} 13. Qh6 {1} Bf5 {-1.75/11 29} 14. Bxf5 {4}
>gxf5 {-0.41/12 64} 15. Rae1 {3} Re8 {0.94/12 70} 16. Re3
>{29} Bf8 {0.97/14 28} 17. Rxe8 {77} Qxe8 {0.78/16 0}
>18. Qxf6 {4} Qd7 {0.69/13 28} 19. Re1 {18} Bg7 {0.62/14 93}
>20. Qe7 {3} Qxe7 {0.69/13 76} 21. Rxe7 {2} Bf6 {0.66/13 20}
>22. Re8+ {2} Kg7 {0.66/12 0} 23. Nf3 {3} Kg6 {0.72/13 38}
>24. Nd1 {4} a6 {0.78/13 63} 25. Ne3 {12} Bxb2 {0.56/12 25}
>26. Nh4+ {2} Kf6 {0.81/13 35} 27. Nexf5 {3} Be5 {1.03/12
>16} 28. g3 {5} Bc7 {1.22/12 12} 29. f4 {30} Ra7 {2.44/13
>20} 30. Kg2 {2} Nd7 {2.53/13 14} 31. Rh8 {34} Ne5 {2.91/14
>10} 32. fxe5+ {3} Bxe5 {3.00/13 18} 33. Kf3 {18} Ke6
>{3.09/14 0} 34. Re8+ {6} Kf6 {4.19/13 12} 35. Kg4 {24} b6
>{6.22/13 33} 36. Nf3 {32} Bc3 {6.94/13 0} 37. h4 {3} Bb2
>{7.03/13 11} 38. h5 {9} 1-0
>
>
>[Event "Blitz30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Nemeth,E"]
>[Black "Gambit Tiger 1.0"]
>[ECO "C24"]
>[Result "1/2-1/2"]
>
>1. e4 e5 2. Bc4 Nf6 3. d4 exd4 4. Nf3 Nxe4 5. Qxd4 Nf6
>6. Nc3 Nc6 7. Qh4 Be7 8. Bg5 d5 9. O-O-O Be6 10. Rhe1 O-O
>11. Bd3 h6 12. Rxe6 fxe6 13. Bxh6 gxh6 14. Qg3+ Kh8 15. Qg6
>Qe8 16. Qxh6+ Kg8 17. Qg5+ Kh8 18. Qh6+ Kg8 19. Qg5+ Kh8
>20. Qh6+ 1/2-1/2
>
>You See, Tiger was here the strongest program!
>
>And here give me Thomas Lagershausen "first 5 moves" and
>i must this play with black - but i this wins! :)
>
>Here:
>
>
>[Event "30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Deep Fritz"]
>[Black "Nemeth,Eduard"]
>[ECO "C63"]
>[Result "0-1"]
>
>1. e4 {0} e5 {1} 2. Nf3 {0} Nc6 {2} 3. Bb5 {0} f5 {4}
>4. Nc3 {0} fxe4 {2} 5. Nxe4 {0} Nf6 {4} 6. Qe2 {0.41/11 33}
>Qe7 {4} 7. O-O {0.47/11 40} d5 {4} 8. Nxf6+ {0.34/12 55}
>gxf6 {2} 9. d4 {0.31/12 61} e4 {2} 10. Nd2 {0.22/11 31} Rg8
>{7} 11. Nb3 {0.19/11 49} Bg4 {5} 12. Bxc6+ {0.38/13 65}
>bxc6 {3} 13. Qa6 {0.25/13 68} Bf3 {2} 14. g3 {0.28/13 42}
>Qf7 {23} 15. Qxc6+ {1.16/12 24} Qd7 {2} 16. Qxa8+ {1.13/13
>28} Kf7 {2} 17. Nd2 {-0.19/13 43} Bc5 {7} 18. Qxd5+
>{-0.37/14 26} Qxd5 {2} 19. dxc5 {-0.47/13 19} Qf5 {16}
>20. Nxf3 {-0.94/14 33} exf3 {2} 21. Kh1 {-0.97/14 31} Re8
>{4} 22. Be3 {-1.06/13 41} Re5 {46} 23. g4 {-1.59/15 0} Qxc2
>{24} 24. Bd4 {-1.41/13 12} Re4 {34} 25. Rac1 {-2.03/13 2}
>Qa4 {11} 26. Be3 {-1.91/13 30} Qxa2 {21} 27. c6 {-2.09/12
>4} Qxb2 {38} 28. Bxa7 {-2.59/14 0} Rxg4 {5} 29. Rfe1
>{-3.09/13 27} Rg2 {5} 30. Rg1 {-3.22/14 33} Rxg1+ {35}
>31. Rxg1 {-3.34/19 0} Qc3 {7} 32. Be3 {-3.47/16 24} Qxc6
>{2} 33. Rd1 {-3.59/15 40} Qe4 {11} 34. Rd7+ {-3.78/14 10}
>Ke6 {6} 35. Rd1 {-4.00/16 52} f5 {7} 36. Re1 {-3.97/14 12}
>Kf7 {2} 37. Rc1 {-4.50/15 23} f4 {2} 38. Ba7 {-5.03/15 27}
>c6 {7} 39. Bb6 {-5.00/15 24} Qe5 {21} 40. Rg1 {-5.37/15 3}
>c5 {3} 41. Ba5 {-5.59/15 16} c4 {3} 42. Bb4 {-5.91/15 14}
>c3 {2} 43. Ba3 {-8.34/15 29} Qb5 {28} 44. Bd6 {-11.31/15
>13} Qb6 {8} 45. Ba3 {-10.87/13 8} Qxf2 {5} 0-1
>
>...and this first 3 moves give me Steffen Jakob, but i wins:
>
>
>[Event "30'"]
>[Site "?"]
>[Date "2001.??.??"]
>[Round "?"]
>[White "Nemeth,Eduard"]
>[Black "Fritz 6b"]
>[ECO "A00"]
>[Result "1-0"]
>
>1. a4 {0} a5 {0} 2. h4 {4} h5 {0} 3. d4 {4} d5 {0} 4. g3
>{16} Nf6 {0.03/14 65} 5. c3 {7} g6 {0.03/16 52} 6. Bh3 {7}
>Bxh3 {-0.41/15 46} 7. Nxh3 {16} Ra6 {-0.41/15 31} 8. Bg5
>{13} Bg7 {-0.31/14 43} 9. Nd2 {8} Nbd7 {-0.31/13 51}
>10. Kf1 {3} O-O {-0.56/12 33} 11. Nf3 {4} Ne4 {-0.63/13 63}
>12. Kg2 {4} c6 {-0.53/12 56} 13. Qc1 {4} Rb6 {-0.59/13 109}
>14. Bh6 {5} Bxh6 {-0.88/13 54} 15. Qxh6 {4} Rxb2 {-0.88/12
>24} 16. Nf4 {16} Qe8 {-1.00/11 29} 17. Ng5 {11} Ndf6
>{-1.00/12 27} 18. Rab1 {19} Rxb1 {-0.88/12 15} 19. Rxb1 {2}
>Nxg5 {-0.81/12 24} 20. Qxg5 {9} Ne4 {-0.72/13 29} 21. Qh6
>{6} b5 {-0.59/12 19} 22. axb5 {11} e5 {-0.34/12 17}
>23. dxe5 {2} Qxe5 {-0.03/12 53} 24. bxc6 {6} Nxc3 {-0.09/11
>22} 25. Rb7 {4} Qe4+ {0.47/11 49} 26. f3 {10} Qc2 {1.09/12
>14} 27. Re7 {9} Qc1 {1.56/11 13} 28. Qg5 {16} Qe1 {2.03/11
>17} 29. Nxg6 {11} Ne4 {9.59/13 32} 30. Rxe4 {10} dxe4
>{10.94/12 11} 31. Ne7+ {19} Kh7 {11.03/13 18} 32. Qxh5+
>{11} 1-0
>
>All this was in Gambitsoft forum and i plaved all games soon.
>You can ask Steffen Jakob! :)
>
>Regards,
>Eduard
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