Author: Derek Mauro
Date: 11:46:12 03/24/01
Go up one level in this thread
On March 23, 2001 at 17:50:15, James T. Walker wrote: >On March 23, 2001 at 14:35:06, Derek Mauro wrote: > >>On March 23, 2001 at 01:09:23, James T. Walker wrote: >> >>>On March 23, 2001 at 00:49:45, James T. Walker wrote: >>> >>>>On March 22, 2001 at 17:55:07, Derek Mauro wrote: >>>> >>>>>I'm no expert on computer chess, but I thought I'd call this to everyone's >>>>>attention. I was analyzing one of my recent games with Tiger (reg. and gambit), >>>>>and had a drawn position(I had black). >>>>> >>>>>[D]8/8/8/8/1n6/2K5/p7/6k1 w - - 0 111 >>>>> >>>>>For some reason, in the obvious draw, Tiger gives it -12 and wants to play >>>>>Kxb4?? even after like 20 minutes. All the programs seem to think its about -6 >>>>>or so, but they all play the correct move, the obvious Kb2. Is this a bug? >>>>>(The 4 piece tablebases will easily solve this bug, but this position is so >>>>>incredibly easy that I can't see why it would even need them.) >>>>> >>>>>This next position is also from the same game that all programs seem to have >>>>>trouble with, but I don't believe this is a bug. >>>>> >>>>>[D]8/1k6/2n5/8/6r1/p1K5/7R/8 b - - 0 87 >>>>> >>>>>Most programs want to play Nb4, but from there white can force a draw. I think >>>>>Ra4 is the correct move (Na5 might also work), but I'm not sure. I also fell to >>>>>the tempation of Nb4 during the game :( >>>>> >>>>>Derek >>>> >>>>Hello Derek, >>>>Can you post a line which gives white the draw after Nb4? It seems to me that >>>>black should still win this ending. What am I missing? >>>>Jim >>> >>>This is funny. The more I look at it the more I can't see how to win it either! >>>:-) >>>Jim >> >>The rest of the game went like this: >>87... Nb4 88. Rh7+ Ka6 89. Kb3 a2 90. Rh6+ Kb5 91. Rh5+ Kb6 92. Rh6+ Kc5 93. >>Rh5+ Kd4 94. Rh1 Kd3 95. Rd1+ Ke2 96. Rh1 Kd2 97. Rh2+ Ke3 98. Rh3+ Kf2 99. Rh1 >>Rf4 100. Ra1 Ke2 101. Kc3 Re4 102. Rh1 Ke3 103. Re1+ Kf2 104. Ra1 Rg4 105. Kb3 >>Ke3 106. Kc3 Ke2 107. Rh1 Ke3 108. Re1+ Kf2 109. Ra1 1/2-1/2 >> >>Trading rooks on the 1st rank results in the position in the first diagram. All >>those moves are pretty much forced. There are a couple other moves in there, >>but none of them work (I think). There is no way to trade rooks closer to the >>promotion square, I already tried that. I think Ra4 was better, because it >>allows the knight to move and eventually attack the promotion square. >>Supporting a pawn from behind with a rook is also a basic principle. Very tough >>endgame! > >I worked on this a little while today with Fritz 6e.. This is what "we" came up >with. 1....Nb4 2. Rh7+ Kc6 3. Kb3 a2 4. Rh6+ Kd5 5. Rh1 Rh4 6. Rg1 Kc5 7. Rg5+ >Kd4 8. Rg1 Rh8 9. Kb2 Ra8 10. Rd1+ Ke3 11. Ra1 Nd3 12. Kb3 Kd4 13. Kc2 Rb8 14 >Kd2 Rb2+ & mate in 9 ..... 0-1 > >I think if Sune Larrson can post lines like this, then so can I. :-) >I have no idea if this would really work or not so just consider it as a >"dream". >Jim I think that 5. Rh1 is an inaccuracy. The black king want to be on c5. I think 5. Ra4+ is better because then if the king moves to the 4th rank, that whole trick with Rh4 is impossible, since the king has to be on c5. Computers don't help too much here.
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