Author: Frank Quisinsky
Date: 10:05:19 04/14/01
Go up one level in this thread
On April 14, 2001 at 12:00:34, Jonas Cohonas wrote: >On April 14, 2001 at 11:45:07, Chris Taylor wrote: > >>On April 14, 2001 at 11:11:39, Jonas Cohonas wrote: >> >>>On April 14, 2001 at 06:31:18, Frank Quisinsky wrote: >>> >>>>Hello, >>>> >>>>it is a very interesting match. >>>>World Champion Vladimir Kramnik vs. Computer World Champion 1996, 1999, 2000 and >>>>IPCCC Champion 2000, 2001 Shredder. >>>> >>>>I don`t believe that a winner from a living room tournament can play against WM >>>>Vladmir Kramnik. The "Donald Duck" qualifikation in a "Micky Mouse" tournament >>>>is not interesting. >>>> >>>>Compare to: >>>>Frank Quisinsky play a WinBoard tourney at home and the winner can play against >>>>Kasparov :-)) >>>> >>>>Shredder won all important tournaments and I think it is not a question which >>>>program can / must play against Vladimir Kramnik. >>>> >>>>The question for me is now: >>>>If Enrique play a quallification tournament I can`t believe that the TOP >>>>programmer will start on this tournament. In the regular tournaments no program >>>>can beat Shredder after now 33 games. So I think for the top programmers is also >>>>clear which program must play against Vladimir Kramnik. >>>> >>>>Now we will see ... >>>>I lose my interest on computer chess if I see that Shredder can`t not play >>>>directly against Vladimir Kramnik. >>>> >>>>But interesting is: >>>>After the big event Shredder vs. Kramnik a living room tournament is good enough >>>>for play after the game 1 blitz game against Vladimir Kramnik :-)) >>>> >>>>What thinking the members of CCC. >>>>I wonder if the most member have an other opinion. >>>> >>>>What thinking the programmer of Junior, Fritz, Gandalf, The King, Rebel, Hiarcs, >>>>Nimzo, Shredder, Tiger ! >>>> >>>>Yes Christophe, Ed, Amir what do you think: >>>> >>>>Do you think I will play vs. Vladimir Kramnik or do you think no Shredder must >>>>play against Vladimir Kramnik. >>>> >>>>Best >>>>Frank >>> >>>Frank i respect you a lot, but this time you seem to have gone off the Deep end >>>so to speak. The reason i think a qualification of progs is important and asked >>>for, is the fact that Shedder don't perform as well in tournaments when beta >>>testers is running them, therefore we need to have a shootout between all the >>>best progs, also GT2 and CT14 has, AFAIK, not had a chance to meet Shredder 5 >>>or Deep Shredder in "real" tounament like IPCCC. Program strenght changes all >>>the time or should i say increase. Also it is important to take into account, >>>that this time it is man Vs. machine and all bets are off, actually we should >>>have a top ten of programs meet ten human GM's to determine what prog will get >>>the honour, but since i don't see that happening we should settle for the second >>>best thing and let the progs have a silicon shootout in order to get the best >>>opponent for Kramnik. If Shredder is really so dominating as the record suggest >>>,33 and no losses, then there should be nothing to worry about, but i for one >>>would like to be sure. As to the "donald duck"/"mickey mouse" reference >>>i can only shake my head in disbelief, but it rhymes perfectly with your recent >>>enthusiastic posts of Shredder Vs the Web, which i have found strange since you, >>>AFAIK, dont even test Shredder yourself. >>>I think in retrospect that from prog Vs human scores Deep Junior should play >>>Kramnik, but putting it that simply, would not be fair to all the other progs, >>>so i say let the nodes decide :-) As a chess enthusiast one should not forget >>>that COMPetition and COMPetitions will always make our beloved progs stronger, >>>no one prog should get exclusive right's to such a match due to 33 games. >>>Imagine if you should chose a human opponent in this case kramnik Vs X, but then >>>saying: "hey there is this guy who have scored better than kramnik on fics in >>>the last 33 games he played so he should play instead" only to find out that >>>this guy was shredder in disguise lol :-) no just kidding here, but as a beta >>>tester only selecting one prog based on previous results seems absurd. >>>GO DJ. >>> >>>Regards >>>Jonas >>> >>>Regards >>>Jonas >>> >>>Ps: My reference to IPCCC being a "real" tounament, is not meant as condesending >>>just to sinlge it out from other tournaments, (like the brilliant ones of >>>mr.Enrique ) >> >>Ask him to play a *simul* against all of them. Line up 10 computers. It would >>be a sight to see his eyes glaze over, as he battled the best computers + >>programs! >>This way you don't need to pick out one prog, and have a bunch of others lose >>out! >> >>Chris Taylor > >Good idea, but i dont see that happening :-( i would even go a step further and >say we should have a double round robin bet(a)ween the top ten human players and >the top ten progs. But how do we find out who's the top ten engines VS human's? > >Regards >Jonas Hi Jonas, yes the idea is for the first moment good, only for the first moment :-) The comptuer chess people will see a match against the World Champion. The Grandmasters will see a match from a Computer Chess World Champion against Kramnik. For me is clear ... Highlander princip !! Best Frank
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