Author: Christophe Theron
Date: 23:10:47 04/16/01
Go up one level in this thread
On April 16, 2001 at 02:09:11, Sandro Necchi wrote:
>On April 15, 2001 at 14:07:19, Christophe Theron wrote:
>
>>On April 15, 2001 at 12:35:52, Sandro Necchi wrote:
>>
>>>On April 15, 2001 at 04:15:41, Christophe Theron wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 15, 2001 at 02:54:22, Sandro Necchi wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Sorry, but you all are testing COMMERCIAL versions!
>>>>>
>>>>>The tournament version of these programs are something else!!!!
>>>>>
>>>>>So this means different results.
>>>>>
>>>>>Hope to have been clear enough!
>>>>>
>>>>>Sandro Necchi
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Sounds like a lack of good arguments. "Hey, don't look at what exists now, just
>>>>imagine what could exist in a few months".
>>>
>>>WE ALL KNOW THAT THE TOURNAMENT VERSION OF OUR PROGRAMS ARE STRONGER AND
>>>DIFFERENT.
>>
>>
>>
>>Do you mean that the Shredder used during tournaments is stronger than the one
>>which is sold to your customers?
>
>Of course it is. It must score the best in a few games, not to mention other
>differences. I am sure you know it!
>The same is for all tournament versions of all programs! Do you mean you bring a
>weaker version to the championship tournament or the same one?
Gambit Tiger won the french and dutch Open, and it was the commercial engine
(actually the last beta version).
I think in the dutch open Jeroen has been influencing the choice of the opening
lines (the probability to play a line or another one), but apart from that it
was the commercial engine with the commercial book.
Can you confirm here that there exist a special version of Shredder which is
playing in tournaments and which is not sold commercially?
>>>NOBODY KNOWS WHICH PROGRAM IS THE BEST NOW BECAUSE NOBODY OWNS ALL THE NEW
>>>PROGRAMS.
>>>
>>>THE ONLY TIME ALL THE LATEST AND BEST VERSIONS MEET EACH OTHER IS IN THE WORLD
>>>CHAMPIONSHIP. WE ALL WORK HARD FOR ONE YEAR TO MAKE THE BEST AVAILABLE IN ORDER
>>>TO WIN IT.
>>
>>
>>
>>The only event where all the best programs meet each other, 365 days per year,
>>is the SSDF permanent tournament.
>
>I totally disagree!
>I am not against SSDF, which I know since years and admit they do a excellent
>job, but the use outclassed hardware and commercial versions only!
They use the software and hardware that most people use. Is it unfair?
And they test the programs generally immediately after they reach the stores, so
I would not call this outclassed software.
>>So many games are played, compared to the world championships, that the
>>tournaments you are talking about look like a child's joke.
>
>You must be kidding or trying to minimise the fact that you did not win the
>world champion title. No other explanations to me.
I have won the spanish championship, the french championship, the dutch
championship, the Aufsess tournaments and many other private (but very serious)
tournaments.
But I would not claim superiority because of these titles.
The ultimate test is the SSDF list. Unfortunately I notice that Shredder is
hiding from this.
>>>SO THE LAST TIME THIS HAPPENED WE WON.
>>>
>>>CAN YOU STATE THE CONTRARY???????
>>>
>>>NO YOU CANNOT.
>>
>>
>>
>>For how many years are you going to base all your propaganda on short
>>tournaments?
>
>Until we win the next tournament. Then we will start again!
Any idea when you will accept the real challenge and let the SSDF publish the
true results?
>>Should I state the number of tournaments my program has won every time I run out
>
>Your program is very strong and you are a skilled programmer, but the most
>important tournament is the world championship. This is the point, you cannot
>play around it!
I think I can notice disinformation when I see it.
It is obvious that you are trying to squeeze every drop out of the WM title of
Shredder, but I don't think you should assume people are so stupid that they do
not notice that Shredder is hiding from the SSDF list.
If it is so good, why did Weiner fight to forbid the SSDF from publishing the
result like is own life was in danger?
If it is so good, what is the problem in playing a qualifying match against Deep
Fritz and Deep Junior? Weiner withdrew from the match as soon as he has learned
that there would be a qualifying round. If Shredder is superior, where is the
problem?
>>of arguments?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>SO MY POINT IS WHICH EVER PROGRAM IS WORLD CHAMPION HAS THE RIGHT TO CHALLANGE
>>>THE WORLD CHAMPION.
>>>
>>>IF YOU WIN THIS YEAR YOU'LL BE THE ONE NEXT YEAR.
>>>
>>>IS THIS A LACK OF ARGUMENTS?
>>>
>>>I REALLY DON'T THINK SO.
>>
>>
>>
>>Be real. Let Shredder enter the SSDF list and let's see what happens.
>
>I told you that the commercial versions are weaker, so SSDF can only state how
>strong is the commercial version which is sold to the pubblic and with the
>hardware they use!
That's absolutely incredible, or I don't understand what you mean.
So you are actually saying here that you are fooling your customers?
"World champion" is written on the box of Shredder, but actually what is sold is
weaker than the actual world champion???
Can you please confirm this?
>>If you can win all 9 rounds tournaments, you are not afraid of winning a 40
>>rounds tournament, are you?
>
>No we are not afraid, but it cost time and money. Having won the real important
>one why we should attend more tournaments.
It wouldn't cost a dime. Just send a few CDs to the SSDF, they will do the job
for you.
>Shall we win a tournament every week to have everybody admitting until the next
>week that we are the stronger?
>Anyway, I respect your opinion, but you should respect mine which is the one I
>told you.
>This ends the discussion to me.
It's not a matter of respecting the opinion or not. It is just a matter of
facts.
Knowing on what are based your opinions should argue in their favor, isn't it?
So you can explain what you think...
Christophe
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