Author: Christophe Theron
Date: 11:58:19 04/17/01
Go up one level in this thread
On April 17, 2001 at 05:34:34, Tanya Deborah wrote:
>On April 16, 2001 at 20:21:35, Christophe Theron wrote:
>
>>On April 16, 2001 at 19:53:38, Robin Smith wrote:
>>
>>>On April 16, 2001 at 19:01:03, Christophe Theron wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 16, 2001 at 14:14:31, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On April 16, 2001 at 13:21:21, Chris Taylor wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>Let the single chip programs play. If confidence is so high that they are not
>>>>>>good enough, then fine. They are swept aside! But at least they have had their
>>>>>>chance! Ed has got a good program, so Does Christophe. Not to mention a score
>>>>>>of other programs, that given the chance to play, will at least be there! To
>>>>>>exclude them from the start of the race, is strange. Unless of course it has
>>>>>>all been decided. Hows' that for a selective search?
>>>>>>If the likes of Rebel Century or The Tigers, fail to qualify, at least you will
>>>>>>have the "Strongest" to go on and play Kramnik. And the people who say they were
>>>>>>not strong enough, will be able to say "Told you so" If one of the single chip
>>>>>>programs does win through, it will be because they had the opportunity
>>>>>>to take part.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Chris Taylor
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I totally disagree. There is exactly _one_ program that should be playing
>>>>>Kramnik. Shredder. Shredder has won all of the recent computer chess
>>>>>tournaments. It is the current world champion. There is _absolutely_ no
>>>>>reason to suggest that a playoff for the right to play Kramnik is needed. In
>>>>>fact, the suggestion is really insulting to SMK and Shredder. If a program
>>>>>didn't participate in the last WMCCC event, then I conclude that Shredder is
>>>>>better and the author was afraid to participate and lose. And by doing that,
>>>>>he gave up the opportunity to take part in this match.
>>>>>
>>>>>I don't understand why there is _any_ sort of playoff under discussion, other
>>>>>than it is politically/marketing related. yes a newer program might be a bit
>>>>>better than the older Shredder that won the last WMCCC. But the new Shredder
>>>>>could well be better than that. closed-door back room tournaments are _not_
>>>>>the way to handle this.
>>>>>
>>>>>The idea is embarassing, to say the least. When we won the 1983 WCCC event,
>>>>>nobody questioned who should play David Levy that year. The same logic should
>>>>>apply now, and SMK/Shredder should play, whether he uses a 486/33 or an 8-way
>>>>>xeon/900.
>>>>>
>>>>>Seems that commercial computer chess companies are just as bloodthirsty now as
>>>>>they were 20 years ago. And have just as few principles now as then.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>By this reasonning, the program that must play against Kramnik is the WMCCC 2000
>>>>SHREDDER ON A SINGLE CPU. Because this is the program which won the 2000 WMCCC.
>>>>
>>>>Allowing another version of the program or the hardware (in particular in the
>>>>number of processors) is allowing an unknown entity to take part to the match.
>>>>In this case, I do not see why other unknown entities would not be allowed to
>>>>take part as well.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Christophe
>>>
>>>Christophe,
>>>
>>>By this same reasoning, Kramnik should not be playing, since he has probably
>>>learned a thing or two since he played Kasparov, and will certainly learn even
>>>more about the computer programs before the match.
>>>
>>>I have mixed feelings.
>>>
>>>1) Kramnik/Braingames are organizing the event, so they should be able to play
>>>anyone they want and who agress to their terms.
>>>2) If they want to market it as World Champion vs. World Champion, they should
>>>play Shredder and only Shredder.
>>
>>
>>
>>As far as I know, the current version of Shredder does not own any title.
>>
>>Only the August 2000 version of Shredder (commercialized under the name Shredder
>>5) owns a World title.
>>
>>If the World title is the reason why Shredder has the right to play, then it
>>must be the version that earned the World title.
>>
>>Computer programs are not like human beings. From one version to another they
>>can become very different. Also more than one year makes a lot of difference.
>>
>>In October, the planned date for the Kramnik-comp match, the title of Shredder
>>will be more than one year old. It is highly likely that Shredder is not the
>>best program anymore.
>>
>>So either you organize a test in order to determine which program is better, and
>>you do not exclude some programs arbitrarily, or you let the WMCCC 2000 winner
>>play, not a different version.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Christophe
>
>
>I am totally agree with Christophe. There are many programs now, that are a bit
>stronger than the WCCC 2000 champion ¨Shredder¨
>Christophe... How difficult can be make a special SMP version of Gambit Tiger??
>
> I will like to see your chess engine running with 8 processors. It will be a
>real nightmare for Kramnik, and the best of the dreams for all us, for all the
>persons that love Gambit Tiger style.
>
>Tanya Deborah.
It takes several months to have a SMP version running OK.
I cannot invest this amount of time now.
I know some people would like to have a SMP Tiger, but I must think in priority
about all the users (and they are by far the majority) who want a stronger Tiger
for their single processor computer.
Computer chess is a race. If I stop improving the engine for several months
because I work on a SMP version, then I end up behind.
Christophe
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