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Subject: Re: What is the public's opinion about the result of a match between DB and

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 08:05:43 04/29/01

Go up one level in this thread


On April 29, 2001 at 03:02:32, Uri Blass wrote:

>On April 29, 2001 at 01:13:07, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On April 29, 2001 at 00:37:49, Bas Hamstra wrote:
>>
>>>On April 27, 2001 at 23:56:37, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On April 27, 2001 at 16:53:28, Vincent Diepeveen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I never got a 0.00 score. I get a near to 0.00 score, so a positional
>>>>>draw and it is *not* a horizon effect.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Then I would say your evaluation there is _wrong_.  Just like those evals
>>>>where you have a queen vs 2 rooks and you say you are 2-3 pawns _ahead_
>>>>and then get destroyed in endgames when the rooks control everything.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>DIEP's evaluation is biggest of the world. So obviously i have things inside
>>>>>it which others do not have and probably never will.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Biggest isn't always best.  Did you ever consider a career in the World
>>>>Wrestling Federation?  That is the kind of comments they make all the time.
>>>>It is the kind of comment I would _never_ consider making.
>>>
>>>Sorry, I can't resist this. But I think if DB would have used nullmove, hash and
>>>no singular extensions, it would been much much stronger. Suppose Crafty
>>>searched not 15 ply, but 25 ply. All the time. Don't you think that would blow
>>>DB right out of the sky? I think so.
>>
>>DB used hashing, so I don't know what you mean there.  They didn't do it in
>>the chess chip due to lack of time, but they did it in the software part of
>>the search like everybody else does it..  I'm not ready to say that null-move
>>is better than SE.  That's not clear at all.
>>
>>at 1M nodes per second, crafty can usually do 12-13 plies in a long game.
>>to get to 25 is _not_ going to happen at DB speed for Crafty.  IE DB was 200-700
>>time faster in NPS.  If my branching factor is 3, then that would get me 5-6
>>plies _max_ more if I could do 700M nps.  I don't know that that would be
>>enough to beat DB.  It would be competitive probably...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>Yet, DB being 1000x faster than current hardware, they could have reached that
>>>depts. To follow this thread a bit, they would have seen the draw :-)
>>
>>
>>They were typically reaching 18 plies or so.  Seeing the draw is _way_ deeper
>>than that.  I don't think 30 plies is enough to see a forced draw in all
>>variations... the key variation is 60 plies deep...
>
>You do not need to see a forced draw in order to see an evaluation that is close
>to 0.
>
>Uri

When you are material ahead?  With a position that a world champion thinks
is winning for white?  You had better see the draw or you are going to stumble
into it later.



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